Issue 18 is expected to raise nearly 220 million dollars over a 10 year period. The money will be spent on the "arts" by an "independent" board.
It seems very likely that the proposed board will be the creature of county politicians and a small minority of arts activists. The board will have no independence and no accountability to the voters.
The board will provide the bulk of its funds to subsidize salaries for arts organizations like the Cleveland Orchestra, Cleveland Opera, Cleveland Ballet and Playhouse Square. The small amount remaining will be shared by officially sanction "arts" organizations.
Use of public money to subsidize these organizations allows them to avoid the hard decisions. Does a first violinist have to cost $200,000 per year? If no one comes to see our play what does that mean? Those artists and arts organizations that are not well connected will have to compete with officially sanctioned and subsidized "art". Most will not be able to do so.
This program is likely to have the opposite effect of what is intended. It may lead to a smaller, less competitive arts community.
Like most County Boards the public meetings will be mere window dressing for the secret decisions already made. Who on the board will decide what is art and what is not art? Is face painting art? If not why not? Who makes the decisions and what criteria are used? Don't ask. It's a secret.
This 220 million dollars will be a political slush fund. Well connected organizations, friends and relatives of politicians and major campaign contributors have watering mouths already. I can hear their minds working, "220 million dollars and its all ours"!!
Vote FOR the Arts, Vote NO on Issue 18
Moderator: Jim O'Bryan
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Bill Call
- Posts: 3319
- Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 1:10 pm
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Grace O'Malley
- Posts: 680
- Joined: Thu Apr 14, 2005 8:31 pm
I have been contacted by those opinion poll people about this issue at least two times. I think the supporters of this are worried.
I plan to vote against the increase in the cigarette tax for many reasons, not the least of which is what Bill Call mentions.
The tax is regressive.
If a tax was placed on cigarettes to discourage smoking, and the money was put toward health care and efforts to help people stop smoking, I'd vote for it.
I plan to vote against the increase in the cigarette tax for many reasons, not the least of which is what Bill Call mentions.
The tax is regressive.
If a tax was placed on cigarettes to discourage smoking, and the money was put toward health care and efforts to help people stop smoking, I'd vote for it.
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c. dawson
- Posts: 194
- Joined: Fri Apr 14, 2006 2:22 pm
wow, that's an amazing thing to read. Utter garbage, too. Hey, I used to work for a small arts/culture non-profit. We were involved in the first attempt to get some tax arts funding, which failed, but not by too much. I do know some of the folks working on this initiative, and I don't think they're evil, doing evil political things, unlike Mr. Call. The goal is to create a board that is independent, a board that isn't a bunch of political hacks, kind of like the old Cleveland School Board ... no, this board is going to focus on getting money to the SMALLER organizations. Yes, the big boys will get a cut, but from what I've heard, it's not the lion's share of the funding. Because the big boys have their OWN fundraising capacities, while the smaller ones do not, so the goal is to try and nurture the smaller ones and encourage their survival. The Orchestra, Art Museum, etc. can take care of themselves. But there's some amazing grass-roots organizations out there doing wonderful things, but barely hang on because of the difficulties in the fundraising world. And I can attest to that personally, because I'm involved in development.
So this issue is a pretty good one. Of course, people don't like to vote for anything that's a tax ... and plenty of Republicans are out there calling for taxes to be rolled back. But hey, I don't want to spoil the party, but taxes are kind of necessary if you want good city services, good schools, etc. You keep making promises to cut taxes, you'll see schools, cities, states, etc. that are unable to keep good services.
And we do need the arts. Some people are frightened by the arts, but it's the hallmark of a successful culture. And while we need them more than before (partially because schools today downplay arts education, since it's not on a proficiency test), the funding world has changed. In the past, you'd see big corporations like TRW, LTV (and its predecessors), BP, etc. donate money to various arts organizations, big and small. But those companies are gone. The need remains, but the funders are disappearing.
So why not share the wealth this way?
Don't be afraid ... the arts do make a difference. The only thing we have to fear is fear itself ... or today's fear-mongers.
So this issue is a pretty good one. Of course, people don't like to vote for anything that's a tax ... and plenty of Republicans are out there calling for taxes to be rolled back. But hey, I don't want to spoil the party, but taxes are kind of necessary if you want good city services, good schools, etc. You keep making promises to cut taxes, you'll see schools, cities, states, etc. that are unable to keep good services.
And we do need the arts. Some people are frightened by the arts, but it's the hallmark of a successful culture. And while we need them more than before (partially because schools today downplay arts education, since it's not on a proficiency test), the funding world has changed. In the past, you'd see big corporations like TRW, LTV (and its predecessors), BP, etc. donate money to various arts organizations, big and small. But those companies are gone. The need remains, but the funders are disappearing.
So why not share the wealth this way?
Don't be afraid ... the arts do make a difference. The only thing we have to fear is fear itself ... or today's fear-mongers.
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Kevin Galvin
- Posts: 49
- Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:35 am
To C. Dawson,
I guess you leave me somewhat confused. You stated that you worked on the last attempt and it barely failed. Why shouldn't the group pushing for this continue trying to pass a tax that will apply to all?
I am a smoker, but I am in Lorain county often and since the sin tax passed years ago I simply make a point of buying cigarettes when I'm out of Cuyahoga county.
Because I have the ability to make my purchases where this won't matter to me it is not a big deal. Why I will not vote for this is the absolutle unfairness of the proposal. Most studies on smoking indicate that the less educated, less affluent, less mobile people have a higher percentage of smokers.
Let's compare two smokers. One lives in Westlake and makes 100k a year. The other lives on Ridgewood and makes 30k a year. They both smoke a carton of cigarettes a week. Three bucks a week equals $156 for the year. This assumes that the Westlake resident doesn't bother to grab his cigarettes when he is just across the city border in North Ridgeville.
Now the Ridgewood guy is paying a 1/2% of his income for something that the other guy is paying less than 1/6%.
We know that this proposal will cost a higher percentage of income for the less affluent. It really disturbs me that we have three county commissioners who are democrats and they claim to be for the little guy but they sell out the poor working stiff. The richer smoker will feel less of an impact than the poor guy.
If a proposal was put on the ballot where all people who make more than 200k a year are taxed it would pass overwhelmingly. Now why won't that happen? Let's think who is more likely to have the ear of our county leaders. A $100 a plate fund-raiser is not usually attended by the 12 buck an hour factory worker.
Finally, you say that arts are important to the community. You may very well be right. The voters disagreed with a funding proposal that taxed
everyone.
I can say that Lakewood should have a police force of 1000 and we will all be safer. No one can argue with that. Now if there was a vote to see if we would all be willing to triple our taxes to staff that force I'm guessing that it would not pass. That wouldn't change the validity of my statement, it would just say that the majority weighed the cost vs. the benefits and chose to say no.
If the people that are pushing this just missed the last time, perhaps they should try again. If the majority continues to say no, maybe the answer is that the voters weighed the cost vs. the benefits and said the cost is not justified.
Just my humble opinion. Maybe I'll open a store at the Lorain county border.
I guess you leave me somewhat confused. You stated that you worked on the last attempt and it barely failed. Why shouldn't the group pushing for this continue trying to pass a tax that will apply to all?
I am a smoker, but I am in Lorain county often and since the sin tax passed years ago I simply make a point of buying cigarettes when I'm out of Cuyahoga county.
Because I have the ability to make my purchases where this won't matter to me it is not a big deal. Why I will not vote for this is the absolutle unfairness of the proposal. Most studies on smoking indicate that the less educated, less affluent, less mobile people have a higher percentage of smokers.
Let's compare two smokers. One lives in Westlake and makes 100k a year. The other lives on Ridgewood and makes 30k a year. They both smoke a carton of cigarettes a week. Three bucks a week equals $156 for the year. This assumes that the Westlake resident doesn't bother to grab his cigarettes when he is just across the city border in North Ridgeville.
Now the Ridgewood guy is paying a 1/2% of his income for something that the other guy is paying less than 1/6%.
We know that this proposal will cost a higher percentage of income for the less affluent. It really disturbs me that we have three county commissioners who are democrats and they claim to be for the little guy but they sell out the poor working stiff. The richer smoker will feel less of an impact than the poor guy.
If a proposal was put on the ballot where all people who make more than 200k a year are taxed it would pass overwhelmingly. Now why won't that happen? Let's think who is more likely to have the ear of our county leaders. A $100 a plate fund-raiser is not usually attended by the 12 buck an hour factory worker.
Finally, you say that arts are important to the community. You may very well be right. The voters disagreed with a funding proposal that taxed
everyone.
I can say that Lakewood should have a police force of 1000 and we will all be safer. No one can argue with that. Now if there was a vote to see if we would all be willing to triple our taxes to staff that force I'm guessing that it would not pass. That wouldn't change the validity of my statement, it would just say that the majority weighed the cost vs. the benefits and chose to say no.
If the people that are pushing this just missed the last time, perhaps they should try again. If the majority continues to say no, maybe the answer is that the voters weighed the cost vs. the benefits and said the cost is not justified.
Just my humble opinion. Maybe I'll open a store at the Lorain county border.
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DougHuntingdon
- Posts: 527
- Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2006 10:29 pm
Actually, didn't an executive of BP or its predecessor demand the removal of the free stamp from its original perch in front of 200 Public Square? That is why it is lying on its side near the federal building. I can't say I blame the executive. What a joke...at least we didn't get the thimble or clothespin made by the same artist that's in Philadelphia.
Doug
Doug
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David Scott
- Posts: 71
- Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:06 pm
I think it is hilarious that every time someone rails against a regressive tax they ask that those above $200K be taxed which would be more fair. Why would it be more fair ? Because it doesn't effect you. You don't care any about the regressive nature of the cigarette tax - you just don't want to pay the tax and feel you can take a high moral ground and that makes you better. Not really.
The government gives millions of dollars for science and math in the way of grants and tax credits and we are losing the liberal arts. Look at the writings of the founding fathers, they were learned in literature and art. Look at the way our current leaders act - they couldn't string a sentence together if it wasn't written for them. As someone who would rather see a live theatrical performance then a canned movie, I would like to see more free art events.
Maybe a cigarette tax isn't the best way to go - but it gets the subject discussed. Perhaps we should have a property tax increase with an exemption for those over 65 and the first $65,000 in value. This isn't regressive and does not penalize the elderly on a fixed income.
The government gives millions of dollars for science and math in the way of grants and tax credits and we are losing the liberal arts. Look at the writings of the founding fathers, they were learned in literature and art. Look at the way our current leaders act - they couldn't string a sentence together if it wasn't written for them. As someone who would rather see a live theatrical performance then a canned movie, I would like to see more free art events.
Maybe a cigarette tax isn't the best way to go - but it gets the subject discussed. Perhaps we should have a property tax increase with an exemption for those over 65 and the first $65,000 in value. This isn't regressive and does not penalize the elderly on a fixed income.
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Grace O'Malley
- Posts: 680
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David Scott
- Posts: 71
- Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:06 pm
The concept that the arts are for the wealthy is a fallacy, and if true is exactly why we need public funding of the arts. You are thinking of the rich couple in the opera box (we don't have an opera) or attending the Orchestra. The Cleveland Orchestra gives many free performances for school children that have nothing to do with the wealthy.
If the tax is spent right it will support Parade the Circle, Shakespeare in the Park, avaunt garde theaters, the city Sparks program - none of these benefit the wealthy but instead it brings the arts to the common people.
If the tax is spent right it will support Parade the Circle, Shakespeare in the Park, avaunt garde theaters, the city Sparks program - none of these benefit the wealthy but instead it brings the arts to the common people.
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Kevin Galvin
- Posts: 49
- Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:35 am
Mr. Scott,
Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. I wasn't reccomending taxing those who make 200k. What I meant was that the majority of the voters make less than that and that is why a tax like that would pass. I would not agree with that type of tax either. (And trust me, I am not in that bracket by a long shot.)
The regressive nature of the tax disturbs me but it also bothers me that our supposed leaders choose to pit one group of voters against another.
To eliminate the comparison I used, how about we change it to we all vote whether or not to tax people with red hair. People with red hair would think it is unfair for others to decide to tax them when they don't have red hair. Redheads might very well say only redheads can vote and then there would be no complaints.
I do need to add that you don't know me and it is somewhat unfair for you to accuse me of simply trying to take the high moral road because I don't want to pay the tax. Perhaps you didn't read all that I wrote. I don't pay the tax, I purchase my cigarettes outside Cuyahoga county.
In so far as you want to see free performances I'm amazed that you would make such an arguement. I think that Hawaii is a beautiful state and I want to take my family there for free. Simply because you or thousands like you want to see a free performance, why should others have to pay so that you can. Maybe I just wanted to stand in the rain tonight and watch the high school girls perform in the annual powder puff tournament. Shockingly, my wife and I had to pay our own way in. Why did I have to pay. It was good for the community and fostered school spirit and yet we still had to pay. Terrible, just terrible.
A fair vote was held where all taxpayers would have to pay and the proposal failed. Get your message out stronger or in some way make a better arguement and try again. That would be fair. To me, and I realize that it is only my opinion, it is unfair to vote to tax a group if you are not in that group. This holds true if the group is smokers, redheads, whites, or left-handed people. Please understand that my choosing a figure of 200k was just to indicate that most people would be voting to tax a group that did not include them.
Perhaps I didn't make myself clear. I wasn't reccomending taxing those who make 200k. What I meant was that the majority of the voters make less than that and that is why a tax like that would pass. I would not agree with that type of tax either. (And trust me, I am not in that bracket by a long shot.)
The regressive nature of the tax disturbs me but it also bothers me that our supposed leaders choose to pit one group of voters against another.
To eliminate the comparison I used, how about we change it to we all vote whether or not to tax people with red hair. People with red hair would think it is unfair for others to decide to tax them when they don't have red hair. Redheads might very well say only redheads can vote and then there would be no complaints.
I do need to add that you don't know me and it is somewhat unfair for you to accuse me of simply trying to take the high moral road because I don't want to pay the tax. Perhaps you didn't read all that I wrote. I don't pay the tax, I purchase my cigarettes outside Cuyahoga county.
In so far as you want to see free performances I'm amazed that you would make such an arguement. I think that Hawaii is a beautiful state and I want to take my family there for free. Simply because you or thousands like you want to see a free performance, why should others have to pay so that you can. Maybe I just wanted to stand in the rain tonight and watch the high school girls perform in the annual powder puff tournament. Shockingly, my wife and I had to pay our own way in. Why did I have to pay. It was good for the community and fostered school spirit and yet we still had to pay. Terrible, just terrible.
A fair vote was held where all taxpayers would have to pay and the proposal failed. Get your message out stronger or in some way make a better arguement and try again. That would be fair. To me, and I realize that it is only my opinion, it is unfair to vote to tax a group if you are not in that group. This holds true if the group is smokers, redheads, whites, or left-handed people. Please understand that my choosing a figure of 200k was just to indicate that most people would be voting to tax a group that did not include them.
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Bill Call
- Posts: 3319
- Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 1:10 pm
Art
c. dawson wrote:The goal is to create a board that is independent, a board that isn't a bunch of political hacks, kind of like the old Cleveland School Board ... no, this board is going to focus on getting money to the SMALLER organizations.
The goal is always to creat an independent board. With 220 million dollars at stake do you really think the politicians will resist the temptation to pack the board with their people?
If the institutions like Playhouse Square, the orchestra, the opera and other "Big" arts institutions are not going to get the lions share someone better tell the county commissioners. They are going around town saying this issue will save Playhouse Square.
In any case you are missing the most important issue. No one nows how this money will be spent.
Will 22,000 people each get $1,000?
Will 1,000 people each get $22,000?
If Beck Center gets a cut will it use the money to relocate? Are you asking Lakewood to pay the Becks relocation expenses?
What is art? Who decides that my urine in a jar is not art? or that is it art?
What would 220 million dollars do for the local economy if we spent it on:
Medical research at Case or the clinic?
or
A science or enginering school at Cleveland State?
or
A bribe to Honda to locate a plant in Cleveland.
or
(Insert your idea here)
or
8 million spent at Rockport Square?
If you had 22 million dollars to spend would you choose to give 22,000 artists $1,000 each? Is that the best use of this money?
Cuyahoga County is the highest taxed county in the State. Our local and state tax burdens are among the highest in the country. Are we economically stagnant because people have too much take home pay?
Why is art more important than the thousands of TAX GENERATING ENTERPRISES?
Perhaps the art community should concentrate on providing what people want at a price they are willing to pay. Now that would really be a work of art.
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dl meckes
- Posts: 1475
- Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:29 pm
- Location: Lakewood
Re: Art
Bill Call wrote:Why is art more important than the thousands of TAX GENERATING ENTERPRISES?
Bill-
I'm afraid you're missing some elements of the arts argument.
Arts make cities more livable and more likely to be visited. Arts organizations have lots of patrons who spend lots of money, both on the arts productions or in ancillary ways that might include anything from lessons to after performance drinks. The arts bring money with them.
A strong arts community supports and is supported by people of higher education.
The arts support education and the arts work as economic generators.
I'm also concerned about who will decide how the money is spent.
I completely disagree with "sin" taxes.
But I think your arguments "against" the arts leave a little to be desired.
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David Scott
- Posts: 71
- Joined: Mon Apr 24, 2006 4:06 pm
I am also concerned about how the money will be spent, but I also look at the problems with the arts community in this area. We lost the Opera. Dance Cleveland had to cancel some events last year.
I don't agree with how my tax dollars are spent, but I don't have the luxury of where they go. There are many things that the county spends money on that I don't agree with but I don't have the ability to pick and choose
And if you go to another county to purchase items just to save the sales tax - that speaks volumes about your committment to this area and your character. That is savings a few pennies to throw your community under the bus.
I don't agree with how my tax dollars are spent, but I don't have the luxury of where they go. There are many things that the county spends money on that I don't agree with but I don't have the ability to pick and choose
And if you go to another county to purchase items just to save the sales tax - that speaks volumes about your committment to this area and your character. That is savings a few pennies to throw your community under the bus.
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Kevin Galvin
- Posts: 49
- Joined: Wed Apr 06, 2005 9:35 am
Mr. Scott,
I see you have gone from questioning my morals to besmirching my values and my committment to my community. All because I don't agree with your position. Since we don't know each other I do wonder how you can judge my commitment to my community simply because I refuse to pay the sin tax. Do you have any idea how many hours I have volunteered to the children of our city? Do you know any of the fatherless kids I have mentored over the last 25+ years? Perhaps our ledger sheets will be compared someday. Dollars given away do not always equal committment.
I did notice that you failed to address why others should pay for you to get something free. It seemed simple enough. I want a free trip to Hawaii for my family and I think you and others should pay. You want to see a free artistic performance and you think I and other smokers should pay. The dollar amounts are certainly different but the concept is the same.
I believe that you have every right to see things differently than I do and in fact you may be heading for sainthood. I know that I can be a stubborn SOB, but I do believe that I am entitled to my opinion without being insulted for expressing it. I have no intention on joining you in the sandbox so I shall bid you farewell.
I see you have gone from questioning my morals to besmirching my values and my committment to my community. All because I don't agree with your position. Since we don't know each other I do wonder how you can judge my commitment to my community simply because I refuse to pay the sin tax. Do you have any idea how many hours I have volunteered to the children of our city? Do you know any of the fatherless kids I have mentored over the last 25+ years? Perhaps our ledger sheets will be compared someday. Dollars given away do not always equal committment.
I did notice that you failed to address why others should pay for you to get something free. It seemed simple enough. I want a free trip to Hawaii for my family and I think you and others should pay. You want to see a free artistic performance and you think I and other smokers should pay. The dollar amounts are certainly different but the concept is the same.
I believe that you have every right to see things differently than I do and in fact you may be heading for sainthood. I know that I can be a stubborn SOB, but I do believe that I am entitled to my opinion without being insulted for expressing it. I have no intention on joining you in the sandbox so I shall bid you farewell.
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Jim O'Bryan
- Posts: 14196
- Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:12 pm
- Location: Lakewood
- Contact:
David/Kevin
Can I walk the line between both of you?
Kevin has given time, money and more to this community and area. David would have no way of knowing that as Kevin rarely seek attention for his work, he just does it.
That said, I cannot with clear mind seek residency incentives, and/or Lakewood Brand building to have everyone head over the county border to save money. Times are tough, we have to save everywhere we can, but I fear the Walmart theory of business. Save money at the loss of jobs. Our parents and grandparents knew how to do it. Our grandparents were able to save money during a depression, and see a movie to boot. They built jobs, and made tough choices. Kevin this was not to you but for all of us. We are not as tough or a smart as our grandparents.
David
I support the arts, I buy art, music, work to put on shows, and help where I can. But I often wonder about the cost of sustaining things that cannot be sustained without constant life support. Especially when an area needs so much in other places.
Opera or feeding kids = Kids
Opera or tax abatement for retail = opera
I truly feel that a city without an orchestra, opera, baseball, football, museums, convention center is not first class. At some point tough choices need to be met. I think I am a first class kind of guy until I have to buy an airline ticket, then reality sets in, and I sit in coach.
You choose
Local Theater or Theater Classes for kids?
Money outside of tickets to support the Orchestra or Music lessons for kids?
Government Art Subsidies or art classes?
One of my businesses is right next to Dead Horse Galleries. I still see Kim all the time, she closed not because of people not supporting the gallery. The place was filled with hundreds every opening, and during the day many stopped by to look, maybe have a sip of wine and talk about their support for the arts. They confused going to galleries with supporting the arts. Supporting the arts is buying art, not talking about it.
This past week went to another opening, place was packed with cheese and wine eaters. I knew the artist and stayed near the end. The only sold sign on any art was a piece I bought for my wife. Where was the support there?
When no one buys and support disappears how long does the government keep a dying business alive? Do we do it for steel that creates jobs and money for art, or just the art?
I think many of these "art groups" have gotten lazy, and have never had to worry about the bottom line or putting out a marketable product. From a person that buys CDs, Art, Theater Tickets, and go to museums.
I have no idea what we do, it is tough. It is as tough as Kevin's choices. Wish Grandma was around to help, she was a tough one.
I also think that forced payment of the arts is a tough way to win friends. Should Kevin pay for my right to see Perlie, Les Mis or the ballet, instead of taking his family to see Hawaii?
.
Can I walk the line between both of you?
Kevin has given time, money and more to this community and area. David would have no way of knowing that as Kevin rarely seek attention for his work, he just does it.
That said, I cannot with clear mind seek residency incentives, and/or Lakewood Brand building to have everyone head over the county border to save money. Times are tough, we have to save everywhere we can, but I fear the Walmart theory of business. Save money at the loss of jobs. Our parents and grandparents knew how to do it. Our grandparents were able to save money during a depression, and see a movie to boot. They built jobs, and made tough choices. Kevin this was not to you but for all of us. We are not as tough or a smart as our grandparents.
David
I support the arts, I buy art, music, work to put on shows, and help where I can. But I often wonder about the cost of sustaining things that cannot be sustained without constant life support. Especially when an area needs so much in other places.
Opera or feeding kids = Kids
Opera or tax abatement for retail = opera
I truly feel that a city without an orchestra, opera, baseball, football, museums, convention center is not first class. At some point tough choices need to be met. I think I am a first class kind of guy until I have to buy an airline ticket, then reality sets in, and I sit in coach.
You choose
Local Theater or Theater Classes for kids?
Money outside of tickets to support the Orchestra or Music lessons for kids?
Government Art Subsidies or art classes?
One of my businesses is right next to Dead Horse Galleries. I still see Kim all the time, she closed not because of people not supporting the gallery. The place was filled with hundreds every opening, and during the day many stopped by to look, maybe have a sip of wine and talk about their support for the arts. They confused going to galleries with supporting the arts. Supporting the arts is buying art, not talking about it.
This past week went to another opening, place was packed with cheese and wine eaters. I knew the artist and stayed near the end. The only sold sign on any art was a piece I bought for my wife. Where was the support there?
When no one buys and support disappears how long does the government keep a dying business alive? Do we do it for steel that creates jobs and money for art, or just the art?
I think many of these "art groups" have gotten lazy, and have never had to worry about the bottom line or putting out a marketable product. From a person that buys CDs, Art, Theater Tickets, and go to museums.
I have no idea what we do, it is tough. It is as tough as Kevin's choices. Wish Grandma was around to help, she was a tough one.
I also think that forced payment of the arts is a tough way to win friends. Should Kevin pay for my right to see Perlie, Les Mis or the ballet, instead of taking his family to see Hawaii?
.
Jim O'Bryan
Lakewood Resident
"The very act of observing disturbs the system."
Werner Heisenberg
"If anything I've said seems useful to you, I'm glad.
If not, don't worry. Just forget about it."
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
Lakewood Resident
"The very act of observing disturbs the system."
Werner Heisenberg
"If anything I've said seems useful to you, I'm glad.
If not, don't worry. Just forget about it."
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
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dl meckes
- Posts: 1475
- Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:29 pm
- Location: Lakewood
Jim O'Bryan wrote:You choose
Local Theater or Theater Classes for kids?
Money outside of tickets to support the Orchestra or Music lessons for kids?
Government Art Subsidies or art classes?
This is further confusing the issue.
These things are not really either/or things.
The Cleveland Ballet ran the Cleveland Ballet School. Local theater usually offers theater related classes and workshops for kids. Beck Center, for instance, offers theater, music and dance lessons for kids.
So Arts subsidies will most likely fund art classes and other programs.
Furthermore, some of these subsidies will generate Arts tourism, which brings monies to the area.
This issue isn't about whether funding for the Arts is necessary, it's about the inequity of "sin" taxes.