Fairview Park Starts Holy War With Lakewood

[Jim O'Bryan]

Many woke up yesterday to see hundreds of these illegal signs all over Lakewood.

In what can only be described as a Holy War Against Lakewood a Fairview Park church,
has invaded our town and is trying to woo residents from going to 2 Lakewood Easter Egg
Hunts for local churches and H20, and instead come to their Easter Egg Hunt.

This would not be so bad, had they not littered the city with their illegal signs. I
would encourage any citizen to take them down and throw them away.

Why let outsiders make our city seem trashy?

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[Kyle Weigand]

"more" trashy, James? Careful...

Also, I feel the same way about the Plain Dealer littering non-subscribers' yards with the ads and fluff sections a few days a week. People leave the paper-filled green plastic bags to rot in yards for days...weeks. I'm a subscriber (I have NO idea why...habits based solely on loyalty die hard I suppose) but this is ridiculous. Know anything about this and how is can be stopped? Do you think it should be stopped? *just curious*

[Jim O'Bryan]

"more" trashy, James? Careful...

Also, I feel the same way about the Plain Dealer littering non-subscribers' yards with the ads and fluff sections a few days a week. People leave the paper-filled green plastic bags to rot in yards for days...weeks. I'm a subscriber (I have NO idea why...habits based solely on loyalty die hard I suppose) but this is ridiculous. Know anything about this and how is can be stopped? Do you think it should be stopped? *just curious*

Kyle

Thanks, good catch! Fixed.

I think what might have to happen is some class action suits against the PeeDee. I too am a
subscriber, old habits die hard. But unless we make it effect their bottom line, I doubt that they care.

What bother me, just because of my non-profit project, though not a 501C3, is that so many
outside forces have declared war on local, civic journalism. With business plans that literally
state run the locals out of business, then only cover what can be monetized. This is the mindset
that gave birth to the Observer, not the WestEnd. That national media groups only came for the
bad news, or what they could monetize.

But hey, that's just me.

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[Bob Ignizio]

The PD "Wrap Up" papers are an opt-out thing. Anyone who doesn't want it delivered has to call the PD and tell them. Oddly enough, I'm having the opposite problem. I actually want the PD Wrap up for the coupons, but the delivery on my street is spotty at best. Sometimes I get it, sometimes I don't. I've actually seen their delivery guy zip down the street tossing papers more or less randomly out of a moving vehicle. Called to complain and still haven't gotten mine with any consistency.

[Myra Beckrest]

I didn't realize I could call and opt-out. Count me in on that one... where's my phone!

I'm guilty of not even opening them... straight to the bin.

Now if I could have an Observer delivered straight to my house, that would be awesome

[Jon Eckerle]

I believe you guys are overlooking the real stories in this event.

Is OBrian against the Easter Bunny in general or just Fairview Park bunnies?

Really, 100,000 hard boiled colored eggs... send a reporter and a photographer over to make them prove it. Just where are they doing this? Have they been enslaving the children of china for months to dye all the eggs? Do they have an EPA permit? Will the there be a big fish kill from vinegar and pink dye in the Rocky River? Has someone called Ripley's?

The citizens of Lakewood need to know the truth. Send your best reporter.

ECK

[Corey Rossen]

I believe you guys are overlooking the real stories in this event.

Is OBrian against the Easter Bunny in general or just Fairview Park bunnies?

Really, 100,000 hard boiled colored eggs... send a reporter and a photographer over to make them prove it. Just where are they doing this? Have they been enslaving the children of china for months to dye all the eggs? Do they have an EPA permit? Will the there be a big fish kill from vinegar and pink dye in the Rocky River? Has someone called Ripley's?

The citizens of Lakewood need to know the truth. Send your best reporter.

ECK

Are these free range chickens we're talking about? They could be anywhere.

Anybody remember The Far Side comics/cartoons/calendars and the "Boneless Chicken Ranch" - now those would be easy eggs to find.

Jim, if these signs were on an "A" Frame would it change your opinion of them. Would you forget the message and focus on the presentation? Would you get out of the Mini and kick one over (only to have it swing 360 degrees and hit you in the...ankle).

Forget sending the Press - send Jim and his gang of Minis.

Corey
Corey

[Jim O'Bryan]

I didn't realize I could call and opt-out. Count me in on that one... where's my phone!

I'm guilty of not even opening them... straight to the bin.

Now if I could have an Observer delivered straight to my house, that would be awesome

Myra/All

Where to start? OK here.

The Lakewood Observer offers mailed subscriptions, it is amazing how many get sent out of town,
we also offer home delivery in some areas and are always looking for young kids who are looking to
make some money delivering to homes, so if you know anyone, tell them to stop by.

Corey

I am shocked you missed a real opener for you to normally climb on. Where was the "100,000 eggs
that just a start for a Jim O'B breakfast!" or "I bet they have to many barbers for Jim." or...
Shocking just shocking.

Johhny Ekrelses (as long as we are misspelling the names of friends)

I realize that you are a huge regionalist, especially if there is a meeting about it where refreshments
are served. However we have many issues here the least being the 100,000 egg claim, but more
about the 65 signs that I counted placed illegally around our city. It is about invading a city that
was working on two Easter Egg Hunts with local churches and charities, and the "online church"
trying to move our potential egg hunters to the burbs, where lets be honest they will hear the
great wonders of the church in Fairview. Which is a direct assault on the residency of Lakewood.

One of the reasons given by people leaving Lakewood, "is to move closer to their friends." An
example of how this works is, Friend A, starts attending ay Bay Presbyterian, and tells his fellow
church going friends, from where ever they went in Lakewood. They get innocently invited out,
and find the service OK, and they sit around and have coffee, then drive back to Lakewood through
three cities with homes for sale. Next Sunday comes around, and they go back. This time the
congregation see them back and comes up and talks with them. "Oh where do you live?"
"Lakewood!" have you looked at homes in ..." You have to remember that churches are even
more competitive than cities or businesses looking for new customers. And slowly they leak out
and tell their friends, "Oh yeah we are moving to Bay because we just love going to our new
super Bay Presbyterian church, so we are moving near by." And the leakage continues.
Meanwhile back in Lakewood, church membership gets leaner, one church closes and another,
and another as Lakewood looses the strong fibers of the community their churches, ministers,
and events they have.

So what I saw yesterday was a perfect storm against Lakewood.

Make no mistake, Lakewood is in competition with ever other city in the area for residents,
businesses, churches and church goers.

I am not for limiting where people and businesses move, that would be illegal. But I am
against poaching, though it can never be stopped. If that poaching involves breaking the
law, then I think the city and law department should seek remedies. If they were find the
maximum for littering, it might be enough to keep our parks open for the residents.

And John, you know that because we have spoken of it many times.

The only people speaking "regional" or "NEO" are those that get hundreds of millions of our tax
dollars to bring in businesses to the region, but have decided it is far easier and far more needed
to get the region thinking our economy is the same size as New Guinea, so if we band together
we could be you know like a third world country. Well that is the thinking they are trying to pound
into us, because they are failing at what they were supposed to do, bring business to the area. Oh,
and the people that think having the same size economy of New Guinea is somehow cool. They also
speak highly of NEO, CLE+ etc.

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[Peter Grossetti]

And just yesterday Fairview Park was one of eight new communities (28 total) to sign a county government-led pact against poaching businesses from other communities!

[Jon Eckerle]

Jimmy,

I got the basis of your interest in this topic in your first post. I understand your perspective on regionalism vs hyper localism . I now more fully understand your perspective on regionalism and easter eggs. Thank you.

I was attempting to recognize the humor in a "extreme easter egg hunt". Perhaps it is no big deal here in Cleveland but a 100,000 egg easter egg hunt does beg a lot of questions. In my mind most of the questions are funny. It is true I really had not considered the impact to the hyper local easter egg hunts. I agree that putting thousands of illegal signs in neighboring communities to lure pagans and children with eggs and chocolate should be prosecuted. But perhaps a cease and desist letter from all of the regions law directors would work. I too would be very happy to get rid of those highway ramp signs, telephone pole signs and other forms of visual pollution. I too hate those signs.

Still it is 100,000 hard boiled eggs... I heard Malley's was sponsoring bunny wrestling in a pit of chocolate.

Jim really the sign issue aside... don't you just want to make them prove that they have 100,000 eggs?

ECK

[Missy Limkemann]

and to think of the $$ they spent on all those egs...that money could have went to so many better things....

[Megan Krewson]

Jim,

Any reason in particular you picked on Bay Presbyterian in your resident poaching example? While I can see how this would happen, it was just the opposite in my case.

I grew up in Rocky River (where the parks are only open until dusk, by the way), and my husband grew up in Bay Village. We both started attending Bay Pres in high school, and became members during college. A friend of ours, also from Bay Village and a member of Bay Pres, bought a triple in Lakewood and rented it out to his friends (including my husband). 3 of the 4 guys living in the Lakewood house attended Bay Pres regularly, and also loved living in Lakewood.

When my husband and I got engaged, we began to look for a house. We looked in Bay and River at first because it was what we knew from our childhood. We knew we wanted a walkable, vibrant community, thanks in part to Dr. Larry Keller’s urban studies classes at Cleveland State and my husband’s experience renting. We just didn’t find what we were looking for in Bay or River, and once we started to look in Lakewood, we were hooked. We ended up purchasing a house in Lakewood, and absolutely love living here, are excited and involved in great things that are happening, and have no plans whatsoever to move. So, you see, our Bay Pres connection actually helped influence our move to Lakewood, not the other way around!

Bay Pres actually has an active, informal community group of great people who live in Lakewood and West Park who meet regularly in each other’s homes to share life together, study the bible, and brainstorm ideas on how to be better neighbors. These people love Lakewood (and West Park), and won’t fleeing west any time soon.

In addition, Bay Pres is doing some great things on the near west side of Cleveland. This article explains how the church just recently purchased a closed church in the city to use as a home base for many ministries: http://blog.cleveland.com/metro/2012/02 ... n_bay.html

Just thought I would step in to defend a great church that is not inward focused on the city of Bay Village

Back to the issue at hand – the Easter egg hunt. I definitely don’t agree with putting up yard signs, just like I don’t like free newspapers and advertisements I didn’t ask for cluttering my front door. However, I don’t think the church had sinister intentions. Perhaps they simply wanted to invite neighbors to an Easter egg hunt? Is there any reason why a family couldn’t go to a couple Easter egg hunts? Why does this have to be a Fairview vs. Lakewood battle? Perhaps you could write them a letter and suggest they pay for an ad in the Observer next year to advertise their event

Jim, you often seem to see the negative in people and situations. I prefer to see the good intentions behind people’s actions until they prove me otherwise. Lakewood has a lot of great things going for it as a community. Our focus should be on promoting the things that make Lakewood great, not picking on other cities or complaining about politics and issues that just aren’t that important.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Jim,

Any reason in particular you picked on Bay Presbyterian in your resident poaching example? While I can see how this would happen, it was just the opposite in my case.

Megan

I appreciate you sharing your story and it is a good one. The reason for Bay Presbyterian is it is
one of the new "Super Churches" on the west side in suburbia. While it has claimed some of the
leakage from Lakewood, it is nothing more than a name grabbed out of the air.

Of course with religious entities, it is not as "competitive" as say with bars or restaurants, and to a
certain extent, successful churches like Bay P. do not need to suck people in, as many of the
parishioners do.

While I would agree it might be hard to finger a church, and all churches outside of the office reach
out to spread the word as all churches and for that matter Christians are part of an evangelical
movement (not meant as a extreme right Evangelical political statement). It is natural and part of
everyday life. What I am talking of is the fight, in the trenches of an inner ring suburb losing
parishes as well as parishioners. This is a study that we took almost 5 years ago which noticed for
lack of a better description disturbing trends with the movement of churches, ministers, and eventual
parishioners. Of course there are exceptions to everything. One is right here in Lakewood. It was
also something we noticed not just here but in many inner ring suburbs, that they loose a very
popular minister, that goes to the burbs, taking many of the flock with him. He is replaced by a
younger minister, and often a female minister that does not seem as strong or as charismatic as
the one that left. Parishioners move on, churches close. Reverend Paula Mader Connor would be
an exception to this rule. She has come in and has done wonderful things in the community and
has become a true leader, though it has been over a long period of time.

I love Lakewood, I like Bay, Westlake where I have a paper, I like Euclid, Cleveland Heights, and
many other places where I have papers or are putting papers or just travel too. But what I bleed, is
Lakewood and if you want to believe it or not, inner ring suburbs like Lakewood are on the losing
end of many, many things, so I am sensitive to how and why we are losing. There are many
reasons given for moving, taxes, safety, schools, and even not wanting to live with people like
me. Some can be addressed others are simple the constant churn of development. One of the
biggest as studied, and put out by the Catholic Church is religion. As we found out when we
studied this ourselves was not just religion/churches, but the peer pressure from the congregation.
Not in some sort of evil sneaky, way, but in a friendly way.

For every example you can give of them wanting you to live in Lakewood, I can send you a name
of an ex-Lakewoodite eagerly wanting their old friends to "move out by us..."

To not recognize all of the aspects of of what happens in the life and death of a community would
be negligent on my part.

Right?

Thanks for the replay and for the good story.

Happy Easter

peace

[Colleen Wing]

If other cities would just stop having nice things and doing cool stuff then everyone would just stay in Lakewood?

We actually know people that go to this church. It is quite nice and took over a church that was shut down. It serves the whole region and they too are trying to creating a community and offer a fun event. I appreciate their efforts although it I am solid with my own church it is good PR for them. I will be sure to count the eggs to so its all on the up and up.

IMO it is less offensive then the illegally posted and legally posted in abandoned houses and run down rentals yard signs from some "to remain unnamed" political campaigns.

It is also way less offensive then the litter that shows up randomly in my yard on Sunday mornings for sure in the shape of a usually wet newspaper.

[Jim O'Bryan]

If other cities would just stop having nice things and doing cool stuff then everyone would just stay in Lakewood?

We actually know people that go to this church. It is quite nice and took over a church that was shut down. It serves the whole region and they too are trying to creating a community and offer a fun event. I appreciate their efforts although it I am solid with my own church it is good PR for them. I will be sure to count the eggs to so its all on the up and up.

IMO it is less offensive then the illegally posted and legally posted in abandoned houses and run down rentals yard signs from some "to remain unnamed" political campaigns.

It is also way less offensive then the litter that shows up randomly in my yard on Sunday mornings for sure in the shape of a usually wet newspaper.

Colleen

I am just curious, when have I ever indicated nothing nice should ever be done outside of Lakewood?

When did I indicate that Lakewoodites should never leave Lakewood for any reason?

All I ever mentioned was illegal signage, check it out, have done the same for out of city mattress
stores, out of city businesses when it approaches being slammed, and political signs.

As a sidenote of this particular advertiser, I also mentioned what has been studied and reported
by many groups far smarter than me, and by the man hired by the Vatican Catholic Bishops of
Architecture, I kid you not, and I often quote and is available at most libraries, "Slaughter of
Cities" a 200+ year look at how cities get destroyed and rebuilt, how and why. This is not me on
a rant. Are you going to tell me that people aren't leaving Lakewood for the burbs?

Would it be smarter to just go, hmmmm, wonder why? Let's build a new hotel?

There are many fascinating cycles in the life and sustainbility of a community. Churches are one.
Are you telling me that Lakewood churches are fuller than ever before? That we need more, or
that we have many vacant churches? Are you telling me that churches are not important to the
make up of a community or the health of the community? Are you telling me that churches, even
the wonderful nice kind ones are not in need of financial stability?

Make any silly excuse that you want, but in my mind, a business from outside of the city came in
and spammed/graffiti-ed/and broke our laws. Is that what Jesus would want? On this week of
all weeks? Now me personally I am willing to forgive as I was taught, just come and get your
illegal signs out of here, but feel free to leave the legal ones, and have a wonderful cool event.


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