Ice Cream Street Vendors

[Ryan Patrick Demro]

The Rules and Ordinances Committee (Dunn, Chair- Demro-Member) met last evening to consider Councilwoman Madigan's communication regarding the potential repeal of an ordinance that restricts ice cream street vendors.

Councilwoman Madigan feels that it would help Lakewood remember its past and can help to generate a sense of community.

The questions the committee is contemplating for its next meeting:

1) Why was it banned in the first place?
2) Should vendors have background checks?
3) Should the Division of Health inspect the carts?
4) What current law would restrict the use of a cart on the sidewalk?
5) How would this effect local business?

This legislation would not allow ice cream trucks, instead it would allow carts in neighborhoods and the parks.

Our committee is looking for citizen input on this issue, please profess.

[Stan Austin]

Ryan--- Good of you to post this issue for discussion. Here's my answers to the committee's questions.

1) As to why it was first banned it would probably be difficult to get a good answer to that. And while that answer might be helpful you still have to deal with today's circumstances.
2) I don't see a need for background checks on this type of vendor over and above any other person/employee doing business in Lakewood. It would just be looking for bogeymen where none exist.
3)Since it does deal with food it would probably be appropriate for the Health Dept. to be involved.
4)You'd have to get the Law Dept's input on this one.
5) The effect on current businesses is really not of concern but rather expanding business oppourtunities and ideas is. After all that's the nature of capitalism---one guy thinks he's got a better idea. Stay out of the way.

Stan Austin

[Lynn Farris]

Ice cream trucks or vendors? Lots of cities banned the trucks because of the danger of kids running into the street to chase them and getting hit. I grew up in Dayton, Ohio and still remember the jingle of the truck coming down our street. That danger is most likely worse now then it was when I was little, but I would think that vendors would be kind of cool.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Ryan

Finally something I know a little about. I used to have hot dog carts in downtown Cleveland.

The reason I believe they were banned all stem from safety issues.

The way it was handled in Cleveland, and still is for hot dog vendors, was to make it fair to all. We had to have a legal kitchen with stainless steel sinks, refrigerators, double bathrooms with double doors. Everything any restaurant had. This was one of the only ways to make it fair. After all a person with a $5,000 hot dogcart could and would set up right in front of a restaurant that hand paid hundreds of thousands to open.

We had inspection twice a year, and the carts were checked whenever the inspectors needed to check or needed a free hot dog.

The carts had to have hot and cold running water, both for the customer and for the person working the cart. What if the cart operator had the flu or Hep B kept sneezing in his.her hands and then served ice cream or whatever.

Insurance, very big, premium must almost match that of a regular restaurant for obvious reason.

The real problem with what seems like a great idea is what is the impact on Rozati's, DQ, and others. These people have invested heavily in the city. they have done studies and plotted business plans. This all goes out the window, with carts on streets.

Also who gets what area. I was the second guy to have carts downtown so it was not bad. The first guy took the License Bureau, Welfare Office and the Court House. This left me with May Co, Halles, and Cleveland State. We stood there everyday building a base. Then a group from New York came in with over 30 carts, and went to war, literally, with us. One guy was shot, another beat up*, I finally sold out figuring winiers were not worth dying over.

These are all serious issues that need to be considered.

Great that you started this thread.


Jim O'Bryan

PS - Only job I have ever wanted to return to. Good money, not a care in the world.

* Cleveland Magazine - Fall 1974, Hot Dog Wars Hit Cleveland.

[dl meckes]

We have, if I'm counting correctly, four dedicated ice cream shops and several other outlets for ice cream in Lakewood.

I'm not opposed to street ice cream vendors, but I wonder how the businesses would feel about it. Perhaps this is a venture that could be done cooperatively (do the shops want to branch out?).

Huntington Beach has something we need; Honey Hut.

I would like to see better food vendors at the parks.

Some of our parks are not close to frozen treat vendors and selling from a cart would be more appropriate in those areas.

I don't know whose responsibility it is to screen vendors; I'd want our Law Dept. to take a good hard look at the situation. Would there be special licenses needed? Would the requirements follow the rules Jim O'Bryan mentioned regarding hot dog vendors? How frequently would the carts be inspected? What kinds of liability insurance would vendors need?

It would be nice if we lived in a simpler world. Parents are not always available to supervise children.

[STOSH BURGESS]

I do not if any of you have seen any ice cream trucks lately, but since I drive for a living I see a lot of them. All the trucks I have seen are old rusty vans rolling down the road. I do not know what the current law says, but what about letting non motorized vehicles sell ice cream. Some areas have vendors that sell from an adult tricycle fitted with a freezer unit.
This would be something maybe more fitting for our community. I do not if anyone would see this as a viable market for such a business. Maybe a current business might think this is a perfect match for their family run community ice cream shop. Just a thought.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Stosh

I believe the city outlawed trucks for safety reason after a summer where children were hurt in other cities running out to or from trucks. You know how kids go ice cream man crazy when they hear the bells.

I am all for whatever can be done WITH current ice cream stores in the city. The problem with carts is that they can set up near enough a store that they could impact their sales. As store owners have made the big investment in the city, I would certainly want to make sure they get the respect the deserve in the process.

The price to set up a cart is about $4,000, with a sell-off of everything to be as high as $3,000. Compare that with what Maggie Moos/Mootown Creamery spent and lost, upwards to $100,000 when you figured in penalties from the lease and loans!

Jim

PS - For the record, the only job I have ever wanted to go back to was owning hot dog carts.

[Bill Davis]

I hate to insert reality into this discussion, but ... we just bought from an ice cream truck last week. Raced each other down the stairs and out the front door, in fact.

It was a full-size van, clean, neat-looking, with a nice, college-age woman driver. Played silly music and everything.

I hope I don't get them into trouble, 'cause it was a great blast of nostalgia and we told her to come back often.

Bill & Jan