Walkable City?

[Kate McCarthy]

Again, we can work one step at a time to improve conditions for our kids and the schools. Eventually, ideas and efforts can spread to improve the snow removal issue overall in our city.

I would help with getting a group of interested people together who have other ideas or want to help plan. I think a few meetings between the spring and fall next year would probably get it done. We could send out for help in the Observer and through the schools. This is doable.

I think this is a great idea and would be happy to help. Bring together the various constituencies (block clubs, the schools, city and businesses) to put together a plan so next year at this time we won't have to go down this same path again. I agree. This is doable.

[Colleen Wing]

Two of my neighbors have their shoveling done by the city, I assume it is a program because it is a city van that drops off the people with a supervisor to salt, shovel path, sidewalk, and driveway.

During the last storm they only shoveld the driveway and not the sidewalk for both neighbors. I could not believe it. They never came back and shoveled it either.

We have at least 5 random people come everyday, because I live on a busy rode, to do it for money. My husband travels and is coincidentally out of town for the big snows. So I either have to pay or do it myself (like most everyone else)

What kind of example is the city setting by not shoveling the sidewalk on Bunts with their own program?

Civic responsibility is great, but getting a ticket is the cities way of enforcing it.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Civic responsibility is great, but getting a ticket is the cities way of enforcing it.

Colleen

Great comments, and thank you and Kate for getting it back on subject which is let's go
back to the start of this.

I noticed the city can ticket if you place your snow on roads, or city property but what is the
deal when the city places snow or ice on your property and then makes you clean it up.

I too live on a busy road, and the trucks place tons of ice over the course of winter on the
sidewalks and especially the crosswalks/corners. Forcing us to shovel once, twice, three,
four times for every snow. How is that legal.

When I spoke with a plowing professional he pointed out how easy it is to keep snow out
of the cross walks(the original complaint) and off the sidewalks. A simple readjustment of
the blade for a second, and slowing down to get the snow on the tree lawn but not the
sidewalk.

Again, maybe we should drop the notion it is a walkable city year round.

.

[Will Brown]

Years ago the families on our block worked together. We managed to get our snow shoveled, and we knew which neighbors were infirm, and the rest of us did theirs. We also cooperated on repairs. One man had a table saw, one had a band saw, one had a planer, and it was common that we would go from house to house to use the various tools.

But that was years ago, and that feeling of community is gone. I'm not sure it can be restored. If we had it, it would be pretty easy for the neighbors to buy a snow clearer and zip around the block, even the elderly could pitch in. But I think we have been conditioned to having the government take care of us, and it would be very expensive if we asked the city to do it.

I went to the office of aging to ask about the snow clearing program, and they were very clear that it was limited to getting you in and out of your house, and did not encompass clearing the sidewalks for pedestrian traffic. I think it is funded through a grant, so may be even more limited in the future as grants are the type of discretionary spending that politicians find it easy to cut.

As far as enforcing the snow removal ordinance, I would guess that that is handled similar to residential building ordinances; they don't patrol the neighborhoods looking for violations. If you get a citation, you can be pretty sure that one of your neighbors complained. So if snow is a problem, you can probably get it resolved by calling in a complaint.

I'm not convinced that you are still immune from suit if you don't clear your sidewalks. First, that is an old case, and as times change, old cases often get distinguished out of existence. Note that it is based on there being no law in Ohio requiring snow removal; today there is such a law, at least in Lakewood. I suspect it still exists because of economics; there are usually not big damages in a slip and fall case, and an insurer may find it more economical to settle such a case than to pay to defend it, especially if the defense included potential appeals. Such a case is hardly such a serious matter as a congressman being attacked by an olive pit! The case certainly is handy if you are lazy and don't want to shovel your snow.

[Mike Zannoni]

1. Create community by talking to your neighbors, leading by example, and helping the infirm.
2. Press City Council members to modify the Code such that responsibility is more clear. "Either Landlord or Tenant" is not making it.
3. Press Mayor's Office to enforce relevent laws.
4. Complain about shirkers to Police Dept, and then to Mayor's Office if not taken seriously. Triage complaints based on seriousness of problem to the public at large, especially school children and parents getting to school.

[Kristine Pagsuyoin]

Kate, and anyone else who is interested...

Let me put some thought into this about maybe when a good time it would be to get together and move on this. Stay tuned.

Kristine

[Bryan Schwegler]

Actually getting the city to be much more proactive about fining people for breaking the codes could have three positive results.

Let's just say the city began to aggressively pursue what I think may be the three top breaches of the code: not removing snow, not mowing your grass, and putting out trash before you're supposed to do so. I foresee one of three things happening.

1. The people start following the rules to avoid the fines.
2. The people ignore the rules and keep getting fines. This eventually adds money to the city treasury.
3. The people get so annoyed they leave which isn't such a bad thing since they clearly don't care about their neighbors or community. That opens up the space for someone who does.

Then you have to deal with the reputation that Lakewood would get for doing this for people looking to move here or move to Greater Cleveland. The question is, would it be a good motivator or a bad detractor?

[Jim O'Bryan]

Actually getting the city to be much more proactive about fining people for breaking the codes could have three positive results.

Let's just say the city began to aggressively pursue what I think may be the three top breaches of the code: not removing snow, not mowing your grass, and putting out trash before you're supposed to do so. I foresee one of three things happening.

1. The people start following the rules to avoid the fines.
2. The people ignore the rules and keep getting fines. This eventually adds money to the city treasury.
3. The people get so annoyed they leave which isn't such a bad thing since they clearly don't care about their neighbors or community. That opens up the space for someone who does.

Then you have to deal with the reputation that Lakewood would get for doing this for people looking to move here or move to Greater Cleveland. The question is, would it be a good motivator or a bad detractor?

Bryan

Good run down on possible unintended or intended consequences.

Is it bad for Lakewood to have a reputation of being nice, and walkable?

In our rental contracts we give the tenant the choice of shoveling and getting a discount
or having us maintain the walks and driveway for a higher rent. Has always seemed a
positive point of discussion with potential renters.

This city needs to figure out what it wants to be and work towards that. The days of just
saying things and thinking they are true are coming to an end.

These are all baby steps, but needed baby steps.

My opinion, if there are laws, enforce them. If you are not going to enforce them, get them
off the books, or we look even more lazy and incompetent.


Without snow, from up here it looks totally walkable.

I think walkable is a good goal.

.

[Bryan Schwegler]

Or how about this...

Start fining the Plain Dealer for littering when they throw all those stupid papers all over the city every month or so. And even better, fine them for trespassing on people's yards when said people have asked them to stop delivering that junk over and over.

Then use the money you get from that to hire someone just to walk the city and fine people and businesses who don't shovel.

Just need to get creative.

[Mike Zannoni]

OFF TOPIC SCREED ALERT

Start fining the Plain Dealer for littering when they throw all those stupid papers all over the city every month or so.

It's called the PD Roundup I think.

I've been trying for several months to get the PD to stop with the fake paper routine. After initially telling me that they would stop (with me threatening to cancel my subscription), they didn't. Now they say they WON'T STOP because my downstairs neighbors haven't themselves called or written to them about it, and since it's not just my driveway, IT SHALL BE LITTERED SEVERAL TIMES A WEEK ONGOING, like it's the freaking Law of Moses. (Even through there is ample evidence that no one is reading this piece of junk, i.e. all the ones sitting there untouched, still in plastic, on the driveway, turning into ugly bursting bags of dirty mulch.)

I've wanted for some time now to pick up every one of these on my and my neighbors' drives and dump them in the most obtrusive spot possible at the Plain Dealer offices, and I still might. Like inside their revolving doors or something.

Isn't there some kind of anti-soliciting law that can be used by the city to stop this ecologically unsound and just downright infuriating lack of respect for people's right not to have this CRAP thrust upon them?

Back to the equanimity . . . .

[Bryan Schwegler]

I say we round up all that PD litter and dump it on City Hall's lawn until they do something since the Plain Dealer is clearly incapable of regulating it's own trash.

FWIW Mike, I own my own single family home and the PD won't stop doing it. I've called and complained many times, they just don't care or the people delivering this are maybe incompetent. Either way, it shouldn't be my problem.

[Stan Austin]

Bryan, Mike---I've been thinking on this for a bit. I had some thoughts regarding clemency to the carriers, but Brett Callentine correctly pointed out the fallacy in that logic.
Then I started thinking about dogs I've known and the analytic ability they display. Long story short, they got to the root of the problem.
Apparently, the PD has convinced some paying advertisers that this method of distribution will be effective.
Plan in formulation--- let's get to the advertisers and tell them we don't support thug commercialism in Lakewood.
Thoughts?
Stan

[J Hrlec]

I make my cats shovel. It takes a really long time, because the shovels are quite small.

[Will Brown]

Governments always have to walk a narrow line in dealing with the press. You might want to read the constitution regarding the limits.

[Christina McCallum]

I've already emailed the Streets division about this, but it's too funny. . .

Revisiting the condition of Franklin after the plows go by, look what my family and I saw today while walking down Franklin (hope I attached the picture correctly):

frozen possum - resized.jpg (69.82 KiB) Viewed 2379 times

I hope this thing goes somewhere (with a big assist from someone) early tomorrow a.m., before kids walk to school!