Which Clause In The Constitution Allows National Health Care

[Bill Call]

The Santa Claus!

[Stephen Eisel]

The Socialist Clause

[Charlie Page]

[Roy Pitchford]

The Santa Claus!

Groucho Marx: ...'If any of the parties participating in this contract are shown not to be in their right mind, the entire agreement is automatically nullified.'

Chico Marx: Well, I don't know.

Groucho Marx: It's all right, that's in every contract. That's what they call a sanity clause.

Chico Marx: You can't fool me, there ain't no sanity clause.

I think we need that clause slipped into a few more bills...they'd repeal themselves.

[ryan costa]

the same clauses that allow NASA, Operation Iraqi Freedom, the War on Drugs, the War on Terror, the Interstate Highway Commission, Medicare, VA hospitals, Yellowstone National Park, Wall Street Bailouts, The Homestead Act(s), the war on Drunk Driving, the Macy's Thanksgiving day parade, etc.

Don't worry: the old people will vote conservative so long as you keep winding them up against teenagers, blacks, illegal immigrants, or "liberals".

When George Washington was being bled to death by his physicians, he was sending a Message directly to Glenn Beck that we should get rid of Medicare. The Founding Fathers were communicating directly to Glenn Beck that Americans should die at home when they are sick or old. They knew we'd have more comfortable furniture, miracle chamberpots, running water, television, radios, nice Irish Housekeepers and maids, over-the-counter laudanum from the corner general store, and cheap hemp grown next to the garage to make our final days more pleasant. if things got too critical, we could send for the physician to bleed us to death. These were stoic people. These liberal pro-lifers want us all to have the healthcare Pope John Paul II had keeping him alive.

it is popular to blame rising healthcare costs on lawsuits. but the cost of healthcare has increased enormously more than physicians salaries, regardless of how much of that increase is so physicians can pay for liability insurance. who are these insurance companies that insure physicians? i've never heard of any of them going broke. it is in their interests that there are many lawsuits, and many lawsuits that succeed.

Tort reform is a popular talking point. but the laws are not to blame for frivolous lawsuits. the judges and juries are, for taking such cases too seriously, and awarding too much weight to them sometimes. it is impossible to legislate what is frivolous and not frivolous. and the lawyers are responsible for frivolous, but they are private sector free market guys, right? it is all self regulating. an invisible hand. Tort reform would just increase the rigamarole honest plaintiffs have to go through to get justice: more money for lawyers and the complimentary bureaucracies and offices that facilitate them.

the cost of healthcare keeps going up. where does the money go? a lot of it might be equipment costs, institutional costs, and education costs. If this is so...then government health insurance people can buy is as legitimate as highways, electrical utilities, k-6 education, all these dams and harbors and river navigability projects the army corp of engineers have been doing for the last 200+ years. These highways are socialism. these navigable rivers are socialism. the hoover dam is socialism. these mississippi river ports are socialism. the Panama Canal is socialism. These ports for big ships at New Orleans are socialism. or something.

[Stephen Eisel]

Nowhere in the Constitution is Congress given the power to mandate that an individual enter into a contract with a private party or purchase a good or service and, as this paper will explain, no decision or present doctrine of the Supreme Court justifies such a claim of power. Therefore, because this claim of power by Congress would literally be without precedent, it could only be upheld if the Supreme Court is willing to create a new constitutional doctrine.

[Stephen Eisel]

Don't worry: the old people will vote conservative so long as you keep winding them up against teenagers, blacks, illegal immigrants, or "liberals".

Thank you AL Sharpton...

[sharon kinsella]

Lawsuits only account for 1.6% of healthcare costs.

Who is bleeding us?

[Roy Pitchford]

Lawsuits only account for 1.6% of healthcare costs.

I would wager that 1.6% counts ONLY lawsuit payouts. That means, at the very least, increases to malpractice insurance and extra testing because of defensive medicine are not included.
"There are three kinds of lies: lies, damned lies, and statistics."
attr. Benjamin Disraeli by Mark Twain

Who is bleeding us?

If you really want an answer to that question...
Federal government takes 12.6% of my paycheck before I've gotten it.
My paying for your Medicare is another 1.4%.
State taxes are another 2.8%.
Local is about 1.4% as well.
Mandatory PERS contribution is 10%.

So, that's 28.2% of my paycheck.

[Jim DeVito]

Roy, If the government does not take all that money how are we going to pay for our military conquests? Not to mention roads, airports, schools, snow plows, did i mention defense? The only reason you have the standard of living you do is because somebody else built the roads you drive to work. Somebody else picks up your trash. Somebody else protect you from the clevelanders. Somebody else protects your airplanes. So tell me. When we go away with this godless commie state that out government has become. Are you going to start doing all those things?

So you can cut out Sharon's Medicare because she is just not working hard enough and you can find another job that does not make you contribute to your retirement. That would leave the government only taking 15.8%. Is that a good enough tax rate for you?

[Roy Pitchford]

My point regarding Medicare was not that I would want to take it from Sharon or anyone. My point is that its not being operated as it should. Is it for my Medicare benefits, later in life or for the previous generation(s) benefits?

Remember the Social Security "lockbox" that I believe Clinton and Gore spoke about? There's no such thing and there isn't one for Medicare either. The money that was put into Medicare by Sharon (and others) years ago was spent the day it went in (if not earlier) and an IOU was put in its place. The money I put in, along with the rest of the country, is making up for that IOU. Will there be money put in when I'm old?


As for the rest, some of those basic services make sense. When it comes to cuts, politicians always talk about the basics (police, fire, schools, etc.) but they never go after the unnecessary pork...peanut museums, roads in West Virginia with 'Byrd Memorial' in the name, etc.

[ryan costa]

The Reagan Administration drastically raised FICA taxes. He used the social security surplus to partially mask his enormously growing deficits.

The state compels us to purchase automobile insurance.

[Will Brown]

Ohio does not compel us to buy automobile insurance. You could look it up.

[Roy Pitchford]

The state compels us to purchase automobile insurance.

But the state does not compel us to purchase automobiles.

[Jim DeVito]

And the government is not compelling us to buy health insurance. You have a choice. The car analogy is the same thing. If you do not want to buy health insurance then you will pay a tax. You are still free to not buy health insurance. You do not have to buy car insurance. You are more than welcome to go cruising around town without insurance. If you are found out you will have to accept the consequences. I fail to see where the difference it.

You'll note the power to tax the people is spelled out in you own constitution. That is what make the AG's challenge funny. If the Supreme Court were to take the taxing power away... Well that would just be unconstitutional... right?