Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Moderator: Jim O'Bryan
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Rhonda loje
- Posts: 647
- Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2005 10:08 pm
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Roy,
Yes I have a gas scooter. I have a basket and a backpack. It carries alot. I go to Nature's Bin alot. I alot take alot of photos on my scooter. It is a great way to see Lakewood...especially festivals! Easy to park!
Yes I have a gas scooter. I have a basket and a backpack. It carries alot. I go to Nature's Bin alot. I alot take alot of photos on my scooter. It is a great way to see Lakewood...especially festivals! Easy to park!
"Dont it always seem to go
That you dont know what youve got
Till its gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot"
Joni Mitchell
That you dont know what youve got
Till its gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot"
Joni Mitchell
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ryan costa
- Posts: 2486
- Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:31 pm
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
are scooters secure?
sometimes I think about getting one.
it is too easy to imagine a pair of thieves loading it into a pick-up truck and driving away
sometimes I think about getting one.
it is too easy to imagine a pair of thieves loading it into a pick-up truck and driving away
"Is this flummery” — Archie Goodwin
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Roy Pitchford
- Posts: 686
- Joined: Sat Jun 14, 2008 8:38 pm
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
ryan costa wrote:are scooters secure?
sometimes I think about getting one.
it is too easy to imagine a pair of thieves loading it into a pick-up truck and driving away
My scooter is fairly low tech. It just has a power switch. I have a large bike chain and lock which I use and I park it in bike racks at the bank, Giant Eagle, Target or wherever I need. However, some scooters (like Rhonda's, I imagine) have an ignition key, which adds a slight bit more security.
I'm actually thinking about getting something else this coming year. I do some riding at night (after work). I had a strap-on, battery-powered light, but it wasn't that good. I'd like to find a model with a built-in light and some other safety features. It has to be all-electric, otherwise I can't take it into my condo to charge it.

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Rhonda loje
- Posts: 647
- Joined: Wed Jun 29, 2005 10:08 pm
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Yes..mine has an ignition key and if you can pick up this scooter you belong in the circus. The wheels lock when the key is pulled out...it's going nowhere!
"Dont it always seem to go
That you dont know what youve got
Till its gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot"
Joni Mitchell
That you dont know what youve got
Till its gone
They paved paradise
And put up a parking lot"
Joni Mitchell
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Melissa Page
- Posts: 84
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 11:05 pm
- Location: Robinwood Avenue
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Rhonda, I love seeing you on your Scooter. I've been researching online the great freedom a push scooter can add to my daily Lakewood commuting. They are push scooters like the ones you see the kids using. But the Xooter made in PA has a few adult models that are very popular for urban settings. Do searches on UTube and you'll see. Or visit their website at http://www.xootr.com/kick-scooter_mg.html
As much as the word "Walkable" is used to describe Lakewood I think we should truly understand the limitations to Lakewood's walkability.
1. Yes we have sidewalks all through town. But did you know Medina, Ohio has just as many sidewalks as we do. (Saw this in somewhere in online researching awhile back). Residents there are just as able to walk out their doors for a good walk.
2. Yes we have many businesses, schools, events, parks to walk to. But how many of you have actually walked to more than one destination in one outing? It is most likely that you can only go to one place and walk back to your home without taking lots of time or walking long distances. This also limits the use of biking and walking as a sole means of transportation to our most physically fit single population who doesn't need to carry lots of groceries home or take/assist another family member along and make the distance. As most productive people will want to accomplish more stops in a typical day this leads to the need for a car or public transit options.
3. Yes our Lakewood street grid is densely and orderly laid out. But for the best walkable communities these street grids aren't small enough. What I'm talking about is the "block" size to give more options to make the distance to a destination smaller. The streets that go North and South between Detroit and Clifton are the worst. They are too long. As most of us have fences and discourage walking through our back yards having to go these longer North and south stretches loses walkability. Have you seen the new school map if Lincoln school closes? Many will have to go far North and South just to get directly behind them to Horace Mann straight west of them.
4. Oh, I'm sure I'm forgetting some more valid points. Do you have any to add?
We are fortunate that Lakewood was built around the turn of the 20th century when towns were set up to be sustainable, efficient, and accessible. But the former streetcars were key to allowing everyone the opportunity to do their business and have the quality of life that every human being has a right to pursue.
It's unfortunate that Lakewood can no longer assume RTA would always serve Lakewood at least as well as it had been before cuts started two years ago. It is the responsibility of the City of Lakewood to see to it public busing is restored to at least what it was before the local Circulators left and big bus cut backs. This is no small task, City Hall could use residents and businesses help in finding the resources to do this. My impression is that he is trying to do this alone and is not getting very far or that he truly doesn't see it as a priority over other things on City Hall's plate. It's been since September the mayor has been telling the public he is working on it. I ask others at City Hall and of City Council and they tell me they don't know where the mayor is with the status and that he has been working on it.
The loss of losing the RTA buses has not appeared on any City Council Meeting Agenda that I can recall. But the public keep showing up anyway for the public comment part of the meeting. City Hall must admit residents have been pretty patient.
What's the status?
What are you working on?
What do you need help with from the residents?
What can I help with?
Except for those who live around the downtown Lakewood area, Lakewood is not a city that is all that walkable. Yes we can all take a walk. But as I pointed out below so can Medina residents! Most cannot use walking as a primary mode of transportation.
According to http://www.walkscore.com . Lakewood has an overall walkable score of 74. Depending on your address it can be as high as 93. At some of its less accessible it is as low as 45. To make it worst even this website admits it has faults that skew the numbers. For example, it only measures a straight line from point A to B instead of having to go through the street routes of following the streets/sidewalks on our longer grids/blocks. And it tries to identify everyday goods and services such as where the closest grocery store is but it many times considers the local convenient store as a viable option for meeting grocery needs.
Walkability is a very relative term. The more important term I hope Lakewood can get back to is being "Livable".
Again, I'm taking the chance to invite you to http://www.smartgrowthamerica.org.
We all could use some education on what was common sense to the original planners of Lakewood and all towns at the turn of the 20th Century. Whereas, the original set up of Lakewood isn't the most walkable of communities it was not meant to be auto-dependent either. It was built around using a public transit option to enhance the productivity and convenience for it's population. I believe some day in my lifetime it will be common sense in the U.S. once again just as it never stopped being for many international thriving towns.
Lakewood has a huge opportunity in bringing back public transit that works for Lakewood. We need to find ways to make Lakewood stand out from the other suburbs not allow us to be more like the other suburbs.
As much as the word "Walkable" is used to describe Lakewood I think we should truly understand the limitations to Lakewood's walkability.
1. Yes we have sidewalks all through town. But did you know Medina, Ohio has just as many sidewalks as we do. (Saw this in somewhere in online researching awhile back). Residents there are just as able to walk out their doors for a good walk.
2. Yes we have many businesses, schools, events, parks to walk to. But how many of you have actually walked to more than one destination in one outing? It is most likely that you can only go to one place and walk back to your home without taking lots of time or walking long distances. This also limits the use of biking and walking as a sole means of transportation to our most physically fit single population who doesn't need to carry lots of groceries home or take/assist another family member along and make the distance. As most productive people will want to accomplish more stops in a typical day this leads to the need for a car or public transit options.
3. Yes our Lakewood street grid is densely and orderly laid out. But for the best walkable communities these street grids aren't small enough. What I'm talking about is the "block" size to give more options to make the distance to a destination smaller. The streets that go North and South between Detroit and Clifton are the worst. They are too long. As most of us have fences and discourage walking through our back yards having to go these longer North and south stretches loses walkability. Have you seen the new school map if Lincoln school closes? Many will have to go far North and South just to get directly behind them to Horace Mann straight west of them.
4. Oh, I'm sure I'm forgetting some more valid points. Do you have any to add?
We are fortunate that Lakewood was built around the turn of the 20th century when towns were set up to be sustainable, efficient, and accessible. But the former streetcars were key to allowing everyone the opportunity to do their business and have the quality of life that every human being has a right to pursue.
It's unfortunate that Lakewood can no longer assume RTA would always serve Lakewood at least as well as it had been before cuts started two years ago. It is the responsibility of the City of Lakewood to see to it public busing is restored to at least what it was before the local Circulators left and big bus cut backs. This is no small task, City Hall could use residents and businesses help in finding the resources to do this. My impression is that he is trying to do this alone and is not getting very far or that he truly doesn't see it as a priority over other things on City Hall's plate. It's been since September the mayor has been telling the public he is working on it. I ask others at City Hall and of City Council and they tell me they don't know where the mayor is with the status and that he has been working on it.
The loss of losing the RTA buses has not appeared on any City Council Meeting Agenda that I can recall. But the public keep showing up anyway for the public comment part of the meeting. City Hall must admit residents have been pretty patient.
What's the status?
What are you working on?
What do you need help with from the residents?
What can I help with?
Except for those who live around the downtown Lakewood area, Lakewood is not a city that is all that walkable. Yes we can all take a walk. But as I pointed out below so can Medina residents! Most cannot use walking as a primary mode of transportation.
According to http://www.walkscore.com . Lakewood has an overall walkable score of 74. Depending on your address it can be as high as 93. At some of its less accessible it is as low as 45. To make it worst even this website admits it has faults that skew the numbers. For example, it only measures a straight line from point A to B instead of having to go through the street routes of following the streets/sidewalks on our longer grids/blocks. And it tries to identify everyday goods and services such as where the closest grocery store is but it many times considers the local convenient store as a viable option for meeting grocery needs.
Walkability is a very relative term. The more important term I hope Lakewood can get back to is being "Livable".
Again, I'm taking the chance to invite you to http://www.smartgrowthamerica.org.
We all could use some education on what was common sense to the original planners of Lakewood and all towns at the turn of the 20th Century. Whereas, the original set up of Lakewood isn't the most walkable of communities it was not meant to be auto-dependent either. It was built around using a public transit option to enhance the productivity and convenience for it's population. I believe some day in my lifetime it will be common sense in the U.S. once again just as it never stopped being for many international thriving towns.
Lakewood has a huge opportunity in bringing back public transit that works for Lakewood. We need to find ways to make Lakewood stand out from the other suburbs not allow us to be more like the other suburbs.
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Bill Call
- Posts: 3319
- Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 1:10 pm
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Mel Page wrote:Lakewood has a huge opportunity in bringing back public transit that works for Lakewood. We need to find ways to make Lakewood stand out from the other suburbs not allow us to be more like the other suburbs.
That's a tall order.
The State is fast tracking a new I-90 innerchange in Avon:
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/35135480/ns ... veland_oh/
When is the last time the State fast tracked anything in Lakewood or the Westside of Cleveland?
State lawmakers are seeking a retroactive change in the law to provide millions in tax subsidies to the All Pro Stadium in Avon:
http://www.cleveland.com/open/index.ssf ... exemp.html
When is the last time the State sought a retroactive change in the law to benefit Lakewood?
Lakewood requested $90 million in stimulus funnds. What did we receive? $1 million for homeless assistance.
There is no money for shoreway development but $150 million in stimulus funds that were ear marked for Cuyahoga County were instead used to build a new free way in Athens County:
http://www.cleveland.com/rotunda/index. ... trick.html
The age of the auto has just begun.
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Bill Call
- Posts: 3319
- Joined: Mon Jun 06, 2005 1:10 pm
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
While the State is busy fast tracking new freeway innerchanges in Avon it took three years for the State to paint a bridge in Cuyahoga County:
http://www.cleveland.com/rotunda/index. ... trick.html
http://www.cleveland.com/rotunda/index. ... trick.html
- Jim O'Bryan
- Posts: 14196
- Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:12 pm
- Location: Lakewood
- Contact:
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Bill Call wrote:While the State is busy fast tracking new freeway innerchanges in Avon it took three years for the State to paint a bridge in Cuyahoga County:
http://www.cleveland.com/rotunda/index. ... trick.html
Bill/All
While we can all debate the future of the car, which is a valued discussion, and we can all
continue our outrage at our government using our tax dollars to allow people to drive around
our city. I think what Mel is talking about is the steps WE CAN TAKE, to produce an affect
that might offset the effect.
We all talk a good game, walkable, walkable, walkable, but very few of us live it as much as
we could. So instead of hanging our hat on merely a term that applies to many, many cities,
we must build and build quickly on that block, with more blocks, so than the goal becomes
not just walkable but livable.
What is so nice about an approach like this, is it takes Lakewood, and pushes it in a way to
be better for all, even if it cannot be perfect for all. I hope we all understand perfect for all
is unachievable. So while Bill and I can speak ad-nausem about how regionalism is not a
future for Lakewood, all of us can still apply ourselves to make/keep Lakewood the "livable"
community that attracted us or kept us here in the first place. This call for a group to really
educate Lakewoodites on how sales tax works, how payroll taxes work, how property taxes,
work, how neighborhoods work, and social pressures work.
I am overjoyed at this conversation starting and the new voices that seem to be ready to
educate and amplify these very important facts of life. As I have often hinted at through my
many diatribes is that Lakewood is a living organism, best to understand it first, before we
try to cure it. No longer can we afford to look at small partitions, we must look at how all
of it works together.
So to understand where we came from, I post this amazing 7 minute 1906 film.
FWIW
.
Jim O'Bryan
Lakewood Resident
"The very act of observing disturbs the system."
Werner Heisenberg
"If anything I've said seems useful to you, I'm glad.
If not, don't worry. Just forget about it."
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
Lakewood Resident
"The very act of observing disturbs the system."
Werner Heisenberg
"If anything I've said seems useful to you, I'm glad.
If not, don't worry. Just forget about it."
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
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Ryan Patrick Demro
- Posts: 257
- Joined: Tue Apr 19, 2005 9:34 pm
- Location: Lakewood
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Mel,
I think you have some good points in your post, here are some others to consider:
1) The sociology of using public transportation in an age of the automobile.
For example, when I worked in Washington, D.C. one summer I was not permitted to take a car with me. So I used the Metro. Now, that is a world class system so I had no problem getting around. We are nowhere close to that in Lakewood. The only time I used a public transit in Lakewood was to get to LHS because I lived on the far west side of the city. I have not used it since then and likely never will unless it rivals the Metro, which is unrealistic and we cannot afford.
2) I highly doubt Medina has as much sidewalk as Lakewood. Please source that one and put it in context.
3) RTA is an inefficient and likely corrupt government entity.
They have a dedicated source of revenue that they mishandle and have for years. I really think that they have to undergo reform before we can really talk about effective public transit.
Lastly, while I walk to some places, I drive to others, and would bike or scoot to others if I had either. People will ALWAYS for a variety of reasons choose varying forms of transportation. I think the key in any movement you initiate is to promote walking, biking, and public transportation options as viable alternatives to cars. I think its fruitless to demonize suburban sprawl, I think most people in Lakewood already agree that it's bad. I think you should continue to emphasize that which is good about what we have and place the pressure to move these initiatives where they belong (Lakewood City Hall/Planning Commission). And keep in mind, nothing moves fast in Lakewood unless it's a budget cut
I think you have some good points in your post, here are some others to consider:
1) The sociology of using public transportation in an age of the automobile.
For example, when I worked in Washington, D.C. one summer I was not permitted to take a car with me. So I used the Metro. Now, that is a world class system so I had no problem getting around. We are nowhere close to that in Lakewood. The only time I used a public transit in Lakewood was to get to LHS because I lived on the far west side of the city. I have not used it since then and likely never will unless it rivals the Metro, which is unrealistic and we cannot afford.
2) I highly doubt Medina has as much sidewalk as Lakewood. Please source that one and put it in context.
3) RTA is an inefficient and likely corrupt government entity.
They have a dedicated source of revenue that they mishandle and have for years. I really think that they have to undergo reform before we can really talk about effective public transit.
Lastly, while I walk to some places, I drive to others, and would bike or scoot to others if I had either. People will ALWAYS for a variety of reasons choose varying forms of transportation. I think the key in any movement you initiate is to promote walking, biking, and public transportation options as viable alternatives to cars. I think its fruitless to demonize suburban sprawl, I think most people in Lakewood already agree that it's bad. I think you should continue to emphasize that which is good about what we have and place the pressure to move these initiatives where they belong (Lakewood City Hall/Planning Commission). And keep in mind, nothing moves fast in Lakewood unless it's a budget cut
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michael gill
- Posts: 391
- Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 11:28 am
- Location: lakewood
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
February first, 2010: another fine day for cycling in the city.
I kept pace with a funeral procession today, eastbound on Detroit. The funeral escort held traffic at the intersections, so riding along with them I was able to cross the city without stopping at all.
I kept pace with a funeral procession today, eastbound on Detroit. The funeral escort held traffic at the intersections, so riding along with them I was able to cross the city without stopping at all.
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Christina McCallum
- Posts: 102
- Joined: Sat Mar 18, 2006 4:42 pm
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Mike,
Did you have a little flag on your handlebars, indicating you were part of the procession?
Christina
Did you have a little flag on your handlebars, indicating you were part of the procession?
Christina
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michael gill
- Posts: 391
- Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 11:28 am
- Location: lakewood
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
I did wish for a flag. But alas, I was like the remora, hitching a ride where I didn't really belong. People in the funeral procession didn't seem to mind. Some of them waved.
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Kristine Pagsuyoin
- Posts: 339
- Joined: Tue Dec 02, 2008 9:28 am
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
So to understand where we came from, I post this amazing 7 minute 1906 film
Great clip, Jim! I wonder what the traffic-related deaths/injuries were in 1906? Must have been a school day--didn't see many kids. Or for that matter, many women on the mean streets of Lakewood.
Kristine
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michael gill
- Posts: 391
- Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2006 11:28 am
- Location: lakewood
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
That is great video, Jim.
The phrase "share the road" comes to mind.
The phrase "share the road" comes to mind.
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Melissa Page
- Posts: 84
- Joined: Sat Feb 24, 2007 11:05 pm
- Location: Robinwood Avenue
Re: Memo: Auto-dependency isn't cool anymore
Ryan,
I'm certain I remember correctly that I had a table of NEO sidewalk inventory produced by NOACA (Northeast Ohio Areawide Coordinating Agency is the Metropolitan Planning Organization for Cuyahoga, Geauga, Lake, Lorain and Medina Counties in Ohio). But I must have thrown it away as I collect all kinds of documents here and there and try to keep my house decluttered. I was researching and learning some about NOACA months ago when I was asked by our city Planning & Development Dept to write a Letter of Intent on behalf of Madison Ave. Merchant Assoc. to be included with the grant application for NOACA’s Transportation for Livable Communities Initiative (TLCI). Medina has as many miles of sidewalk as we do. I grew up just outside of Medina and still have relations that take me back there. Sidewalks are in the city core and in all the tons of housing development. They aren't so much on the main State Routes going in and out of Medina. HA! The point is you can walk around your own development but you must drive to the store! I'd have to call NOACA to find that resource about the sidewalks. I can't find it online anymore.
Also, I'm glad to here you feel that most of Lakewood knows that the glory days of suburban sprawl are over. Based on decisions being made right now I seriously wondered and was partly why I put this topic out there.
I do believe our City Hall and particularly Planning & Development department believe in keeping, restoring, and/or supporting, alternative transportation modes for getting around Lakewood. I keep in touch with them regularly to do what I can to represent Madison Ave.
In fact, I'm happy to report (and soon to be announced in Observer) that Lakewood has won the requested TLCI grant of $50,000. It is a Planning Grant Program: Provides federal funding to conduct or contract for the planning of transportation improvements that advance the Initiative’s goals. The focus area will be east Madison Ave. including 117th bus station to Clarence Ave. just past Madison Library. We agreed that focusing on this eastern stretch will serve as a model that can also be applied for the rest of the Madison corridor. NOACA has been doing some great things and believes in reducing auto-dependency and among its strategies is to assist existing efficient urban cores like Lakewood.
Community involvement will be key to making the most of this grant. I will be helping our Planning & Development dept every step of the way to ensure Madison neighbors are part of this planning process.
I'm certain I remember correctly that I had a table of NEO sidewalk inventory produced by NOACA (Northeast Ohio Areawide Coordinating Agency is the Metropolitan Planning Organization for Cuyahoga, Geauga, Lake, Lorain and Medina Counties in Ohio). But I must have thrown it away as I collect all kinds of documents here and there and try to keep my house decluttered. I was researching and learning some about NOACA months ago when I was asked by our city Planning & Development Dept to write a Letter of Intent on behalf of Madison Ave. Merchant Assoc. to be included with the grant application for NOACA’s Transportation for Livable Communities Initiative (TLCI). Medina has as many miles of sidewalk as we do. I grew up just outside of Medina and still have relations that take me back there. Sidewalks are in the city core and in all the tons of housing development. They aren't so much on the main State Routes going in and out of Medina. HA! The point is you can walk around your own development but you must drive to the store! I'd have to call NOACA to find that resource about the sidewalks. I can't find it online anymore.
Also, I'm glad to here you feel that most of Lakewood knows that the glory days of suburban sprawl are over. Based on decisions being made right now I seriously wondered and was partly why I put this topic out there.
I do believe our City Hall and particularly Planning & Development department believe in keeping, restoring, and/or supporting, alternative transportation modes for getting around Lakewood. I keep in touch with them regularly to do what I can to represent Madison Ave.
In fact, I'm happy to report (and soon to be announced in Observer) that Lakewood has won the requested TLCI grant of $50,000. It is a Planning Grant Program: Provides federal funding to conduct or contract for the planning of transportation improvements that advance the Initiative’s goals. The focus area will be east Madison Ave. including 117th bus station to Clarence Ave. just past Madison Library. We agreed that focusing on this eastern stretch will serve as a model that can also be applied for the rest of the Madison corridor. NOACA has been doing some great things and believes in reducing auto-dependency and among its strategies is to assist existing efficient urban cores like Lakewood.
Community involvement will be key to making the most of this grant. I will be helping our Planning & Development dept every step of the way to ensure Madison neighbors are part of this planning process.