Sense of Entitlement at its finest

[Valerie Molinski]

Recent Graduate Sues Alma Mater because she cant find a job.

http://www.cnn.com/2009/US/08/03/new.york.jobless.graduate/index.html

Unreal.

[Grace O'Malley]

Not to defend this woman who obviously has some other issues complicating her job search, but what other product or good do you invest in with no guarantee of its value and no real way to compare between competitors.

Universities and colleges have increased their costs well above any rate of inflation and they continue to do so. They jealously guard information that a potential student might find useful in comparing them to one another like actual graduation rates, job placement success, and long-term earnings performance of the graduates. Instead, they sell themselves with hard to quantify prestige and "selectivity" by manipulating info they give to that rag US News for their silly "college rankings" report.

For the money a student spends on the product, often resulting in years of debt, shouldn't there be some level of expectation that the student did indeed become well-prepared and ready to work? And that the income level should exceed that of one who has less education?

Although most believe that a BA automatically assures one of a lifetime of higher pay, that may not be true.


http://online.wsj.com/article/SB121623686919059307.html


So, if a degree no longer assures one of higher pay, maybe we need to scrutinize universities more and hold them accountable for the product they sell.

Something to think about.

[David Lay]

Just because you go to college and get the degree does not guarantee you a job. Yes it does help, but there are no guarantees.

My wife attends the top school in the country for her particular medical field. Does this help her in her job search? Of course. Does it guarantee her a job? No.

Your college experience is exactly that; it is what you make of it.

I'd be willing to bet that there are other factors as to why she can't find employment. In my 30 years, I've learned that no one is entitled to anything; you have to work for it.

[Phil Florian]

It is sad that the cost of tuition is so high that it would take years and years to pay it back. I have heard great things about the CWRU Mandel School for Social Work but the cost of attending is more than any job you will likely ever get in that field. The one-year MSSA program will never be paid off by actually being a social worker for the rest of your life. Ugh.

[kate e parker]

In my 30 years, I've learned that no one is entitled to anything; you have to work for it.

such an interesting quote. too bad more people don't share this particular world view.

[Roy Pitchford]

In my 30 years, I've learned that no one is entitled to anything; you have to work for it.

such an interesting quote. too bad more people don't share this particular world view.

Indeed, interesting. Looking at some of David's other posts makes it much more so.

Does that mean that, perhaps, I'm not entitled to health care? Maybe I need to work hard enough to either pay for my own insurance or help my company enough that they can provide it to me.

Count me among those who are uninsured, and cannot afford to get insurance on a part-time salary. I recently wrote a letter to the President, Vice President, Congressmen and Senators expressing my opinion. I'd encourage all of you to do the same, for or against.

Maybe you need to work (or work a little harder) for it. I apologize if it sounds unfeeling to say.

Look, I agree with you, David, that reform is necessary, but the public option as it exists in 3200 (or Dennis' HR 676) is NOT the way.

Let me tell you a little something about myself:
For a period of several months after college (i.e. off my parent's plan) but before I was given a full 40-hour work schedule (and thus covered by my employer), I had to pay for me own health care plan. I had a Medical Mutual plan that cost me $58.44 per month. I do not remember the details of the plan, and it was more than 5 years ago. But, I was also making less than $800 per month at the time as well.

[David Lay]

Let me tell you a little something about myself:
For a period of several months after college (i.e. off my parent's plan) but before I was given a full 40-hour work schedule (and thus covered by my employer), I had to pay for me own health care plan. I had a Medical Mutual plan that cost me $58.44 per month. I do not remember the details of the plan, and it was more than 5 years ago. But, I was also making less than $800 per month at the time as well.

Try having to pay $529/month to be added to your wife's insurance plan...or go without.

Work a little harder? Try getting a full-time job in this economy. Companies everywhere are cutting full-time employees to part-time, just so they don't have to pay benefits.

You're right, your statement does sound rather unfeeling, and considering today's economic/job climate, very short-sighted. Sorry if you disagree, but count me among those that believe healthcare is a basic right that should be afforded to everyone.

[Charlie Page]

Try having to pay $529/month to be added to your wife's insurance plan...or go without.

I'm recently self employed and currently don't have health insurance. I looked into a plan at Medical Mutual and found a high deductable plan covering the family (2 adults, 2 kids) for around $450/month. Medical Mutual has plans for single individuals, as Roy mentioned, that are very reasonable...in the $50/month range.

I think the high deductable plan is right for us as the premimiums are lower and we don't visit the doctor for every little sniffle and bump. We are a healthy family who does not want to be bankrupted if a major illness comes along.

[Will Brown]

Call a cop! This thread has been hijacked.

The subject was a college graduate who couldn't find a job, and consequently sued her school. She appears to be semiliterate and perhaps her suit has some merit, as somewhere along the line someone should have told her she wasn't doing well, but in the land and age of political correctness, telling someone that, or giving them a failing grade, is hazardous.

What concerns me is the apparently common belief that colleges and universities are trade schools, whose only purpose is to train people to work. If that is so, we need to cull out the colleges and universities functioning as trade schools, and call them what they are.

Much of a university's mission is research, so the Mandel school should be oriented to research on the subjects involved in social work. Unfortunately, we have bought into the concept that getting a degree, or getting a higher degree, will make you a better worker and improve your salary. Religious workers get degrees and higher degrees with no hope of a higher salary. College faculties, when it gets down to the wire, are not particularly well paid; often their students earn more immediately on graduating. It is common now that we pay a teacher more if they get more education, without regard to whether they also become more skilled at their job. Apparently we can impress ourselves by citing the number of phds in our public schools, where we should be more concerned with what kind of product they are turning out.

If you want to be a welder, should you have a better chance at a job and a higher paycheck because you have a college degree? I think not, but we have gotten ourselves in a bind where the degreed get higher salaries, so there are fewer skilled welders to do the work. If you are interested in welding and want to delve into molecular structures and how the process of welding can be improved, college makes sense. But the person who undertakes that level of training will never work as a welder; he will spend his time doing additional study and research, and improving the process, rather than actually doing the process.

Too often now college is something like a baby sitting service that keeps people from working until they are old enough to have some sense. If we culled out the expensive chaff in the process, unemployment would soar as tens of thousands of students who will end up as telemarketers would enter the telemarketing field early.

One of the biggest problems with expensive education aimed at specific employment is that the job market changes rapidly. So if a counselor advises you that there will be a lot of jobs for programmers, and you spend four or six years studying to enter that field. you may not find work on graduation if someone has written software that will do programming faster, cheaper, and more accurate than a graduate.

I think a better system would be to give people a wide education, with a concentration on how to study and do research. Then employers could hire graduates, give them some specialized training (it should be easy if the graduates have learned to learn) and this would benefit the graduates through their lifetime as work opportunities change. Teachers now tend to evaluate students based on how many facts the student has memorized (that is how the teachers were taught, and it makes grading a lot easier); I think students should be taught how and where to find information, and I would evaluate higher a student who could demonstrate how to look up the capitol of each state, than one who just memorized the capitols. After all, someone who memorized all the nations in the world forty years ago wouldn't be much use in naming all the nations today.

I also think we should stop looking down our noses (in an economic sense also) at tradesmen, and recognize them for the valuable resource they are, even if they lack a degree. If you've ever tried to plaster a wall, you know what I'm talking about.

[ryan costa]

admissions standards keep going down.

Groucho Marx said something like, "I would not join any club that would have someone like me for a member."

If you're a legacy student from a prosperous family you can get by with a Gentleman's C, then pick up contracts from your family's friends, get in on a new professional sports team after the tax payers agree to finance the stadium, maybe even become president.

the apologists for de-industrialization and free trade treaties urge everyone to get a college degree to "compete in the global economy". this has done a lot to water down 80 percent of college degrees.

[Roy Pitchford]

Call a cop! This thread has been hijacked.

I apologize for doing so, however, I felt it necessary to point out what I believe to be hypocracy. I believe support for such government programs is in contradiction to the idea that people are entitled to only what they work for.

David, this is interesting conversation that I would be willing to continue. Would you be interested in a seperate thread? Charlie, I thank you for your perspective since you have done research on insurance recently and would welcome your continued input.

[David Lay]

David, this is interesting conversation that I would be willing to continue. Would you be interested in a seperate thread?

Quite honestly, it wouldn't be much of a conversation, as it seems you and I are on opposite sides regarding healthcare. I believe it is a basic right; it's obvious you don't. As such, you see my views as hypocrisy.

[Roy Pitchford]

David, this is interesting conversation that I would be willing to continue. Would you be interested in a seperate thread?

Quite honestly, it wouldn't be much of a conversation, as it seems you and I are on opposite sides regarding healthcare. I believe it is a basic right; it's obvious you don't. As such, you see my views as hypocrisy.

Replied via PM to reduce further thread derailing.