Lakewood Alive - The Discussion

[Jim O'Bryan]

A new area to migrate LakewoodAlive topics out of the Lakewood discussion area we be launched in the coming days. This will be an area for discussing everything about LakewoodAlive, Mainstreet, Downtown, and the many aspects of the group that focuses on "Downtown Lakewood."

It seemed to many on the board that boredom had set in with LA discussion and it was time to move LA into their own section. You will be able to keep abreast of all of LA news in this section, and discuss how they apply to your life.

.

[sharon kinsella]

Not necessarily boredom. Just trying to figure out why they won't talk, what's the big deal.

The passive aggressive 3rd grader stuff being pulled by adults. It's baffling.

[sharon kinsella]

It's just so odd. I've been doing non-profit work for most of my career.

Groups I was involved with were very forthcoming with information and actually talked to members and participants. We were happy to get response and enthusiasm and we were also well aware that as a non-profit, it was our obligation to put it all on the table. Such as in the annual reports.

We may have let a board member play with pretty pie charts but we also listed all funds received and the organizations received from and our budget outlays. It was pretty amazing, actually, what we accomplished with very little money.

When I see a non-profit that fills a lot of time and space with sub-par knick-knacks. Holds community meetings with their ideas only shoved down people's throats and also holds community meetings about organizations that could easily host their own, I'm stymied.

Further, when I see the kind of rude response that was given by members of an organization that is supposed to be building community, that they don't have to time to answer questions, they're "too busy putting out fires", I question their veracity.

The poke and run routine was very odd. These are the gifted? Heaven help us.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Sharon

We will try to keep this new discussion area positive, and not focus always on what could be perceived as possible negatives. While I have to admit it is disappointing that LA has not come back to answer four very simple questions about how much they took in and paid out. We should not dwell on this. I would see the new section as a kind of support area. When I got a call yesterday from a person that wanted press in the Observer for a new website to "watchdog" over The Chamber, LakewoodAlive and other Lakewood groups, I told them we have an pretty open submission policy, but that I would not take part. That it goes against everything the Observer has been designed for, open discussion, in the light of day. That while we can offer blogs, we have not turned that feature on, because to have one sided conversations seem more that a little unfair. Hopefully we have beat them to the punch on this site, and can keep things more positive.

An example would be I think they just won an award. If I am not mistaken, "Mainstreet" who Lakewood and LA pay to be a member of just awarded them an award!! While some might consider this as unimportant, I am sure it is worth some conversation. It reminds me of the day that Planning Director Tom Jordan called me with a "hot scoop." "Jim, Lakewood just won the prestigious MainStreet Program for Lakewood!" He then proceeded to explain how much it cost to apply, and how much we had to pay yearly to be part of Mainstreet. I did mention that if you buy a trophy, the word "win" might be not the right term. But this is not like that. This was an award from Mainstreet for all of the success they have had. Not just being awarded the program.

While Observer Inc. and AGS Software does not give awards, it does give me food for thought at our next board meeting.

We might also speak of the news in the Plain Dealer about who has been promoted from within LakewoodAlive to higher positions.

It might be interesting to see what LakewoodAlive thinks of the new chicken idea presented by LA "member" Tom Bullock. I will be looking forward to a possible Town Hall Meeting about how having chickens can move this city forward. I have always looked forward to LA Town Hall meetings like the one on arts, that underline if you can tolerate artists and their ilk for a couple years, cool coffee shops, and soon real economic development like hotels will soon follow. It is hard to forget how CoolClevalnd's Tom Mulready explained about his theater group used the Colonel Arcade for a year then a big hotel chain bought it and forced them out. just another way to get malls and big box stores into Lakewood!

Of course that always makes me wonder, and maybe LakewoodAlive can answer, "What ever happened to that hotel, that was trying to buy up property on the bend on Sloane?" It seemed just like an idea "hotels" that LakewoodAlive would love. Economic development on Sloane. I have been speaking with the owner of the first house and he has said he had a solid offer for his home, and was looking forward to selling all three lots. It was going to be a magnificent twenty story hotel from a national chain. I believe it would have been tall enough to see the river and the lake from the top ten floors. You would have been able to see it from anywhere in Clifton Park, a fitting tribute for LakewoodAlive educational program of the need for economic development in Lakewood.

So that while it will give a permanent home for your questions, i would rather we try to keep it in a most positive light. I know of two shop owners that have asked for a story about their flower boxes. One has a tape of them being taken from their store, "stolen" was the word used. I think this would be a great discussion, as the flower boxes were a great addition to the sidewalk areas on Detroit.

We can also have many great discussions about the how, why, and who are benefiting from the various business programs, etc.

So please when the section opens, after copying some threads, please keep it positive, and I am sure they will come in to answer your questions. I mean, so many have found out what a rewarding experience it can be. Look at the mayor, the school board, the library, and even council weigh in from time to time.

.

[sharon kinsella]

I will speak positively when I have a positive experience.

No double speak, no undertone, no subtext, no personal insults, not under the table, in the light of day.

Wouldn't it make sense to put forth information like the status of the hotel, projections for store-fronts, organizational involvement with short term goals.

Mainstreet is a great idea, however, that's a long-range plan. It will be great when it happens but, there are immediate needs that an organization such as LA could be addressing. Who will fill that service gap and how?

And will anyone tell us?

I give the mayor, city council people and members of the administrataion big kudos for taking a minute or two to convey information to us. I think everyone should do the same.

Answer questions.

[Charlie Page]

In an effort to relieve some concerns of citizens and LA members, I wonder if a performance audit similar to what the City went through would be appropriate?

The performance audit could be tailored towards whether or not LA is achieving it’s mission and vision statements and identify any operational improvements.

What does the Deck think? Any LA members out there?

Would the LA board even consider this?

[Valerie Molinski]

I'm not sure why you continue to subdivide this board into so many topics. There was a great healthy discussion here in the Lakewood board and now the topic is being moved. This also happened a few months back with Urban Dynamics. That board is kind of dead also. They all pertain to Lakewood in some form or another. I don't really want to check a dozen different boards for so many varying topics and I miss a few things since I really only look at 2-3 boards on here for the bulk of my reading/commenting.

Just my two cents. I think if you continue to subdivide so much, you will kill the forum. Things already don't move that fast on here to lend towards such a subdivision.

[Jim O'Bryan]

I'm not sure why you continue to subdivide this board into so many topics. There was a great healthy discussion here in the Lakewood board and now the topic is being moved. This also happened a few months back with Urban Dynamics. That board is kind of dead also. They all pertain to Lakewood in some form or another. I don't really want to check a dozen different boards for so many varying topics and I miss a few things since I really only look at 2-3 boards on here for the bulk of my reading/commenting.

Just my two cents. I think if you continue to subdivide so much, you will kill the forum. Things already don't move that fast on here to lend towards such a subdivision.

Valerie

Your two cents will buy you peace of mind and solid input today. I have heard from other people that do not want to see a split, and echo your views. So for now, no split.

I was only trying to keep the Lakewood discussion for some of the hot topics about Lakewood coming down the pipe, and to give LakewoodAlive a chance to get their information viewed by all.

Charlie

No one is suggesting anyone is doing anything illegal. At least I hope not. This is what is so troubling. The numbers that were asked for should have been simply and easy to come up with. Now I understand that LakewoodAlive were desperately trying to grow their mailing list using the Observer with links to places that you needed to sign in for, but it really does not forward their cause, and only served to muddy the waters more.

This is what is so strange. Why not be forthcoming, what is gained by insulting Lakewood residents when so much of their funding is public money? It is a policy of self destruction. However it is also a policy that is familiar with some of the players, and should be expected.

There are some really, really good people with LakewoodAlive. Curt Brosky, Dave Shaw, Mikelann Rensel, Tim Lasky, Jack Gustin, LO board member Steve Ott to name a few. Again troubling as these are some of the most honest and open people in this city. At the same time there has been people that have asked to be removed and step down from the board, after he questioned some of the programs and ideas. Recently, some of my friends have received calls, and are being asked to speak with me. Again, back door BS, when all that was ever asked is fair and legal questions.

So that only feeds the very real question to council, the mayor and others...

Is this the way you want to be perceived?

Do you want to hang your coat on a rack before looking long and hard at the success rate of the program and the various players?

As the silence grows, so do the questions.


FWIW


.

[Charlie Page]

No one is suggesting anyone is doing anything illegal. At least I hope not.

I'm not suggesting LA is doing anything illegal either.

The objective of a performance audit is very different than a financial statement audit.

[chris richards]

I have always looked forward to LA Town Hall meetings like the one on arts, that underline if you can tolerate artists and their ilk for a couple years, cool coffee shops, and soon real economic development like hotels will soon follow.
.

tolerate artists and their ilk... that's rather insulting. fostering the arts in a community is much more than just a waiting game to lure in hotels and big box stores. if LA thinks that way, then artists putting effort into creating a better and more cultured environment in Lakewood is a waste and time could better be spent elsewhere.

[sharon kinsella]

Or maybe with other than LA?

[Jim O'Bryan]

tolerate artists and their ilk... that's rather insulting. fostering the arts in a community is much more than just a waiting game to lure in hotels and big box stores. if LA thinks that way, then artists putting effort into creating a better and more cultured environment in Lakewood is a waste and time could better be spent elsewhere.

Chris

I want it clearly understood that is what I took out of the meeting. I believe the video of the night might be available at the library, you tell me what you get out of it. There are two distinct different views in this town. One is "cool art districts" will lead to economic development. The examples used at the LA meeting were "Tremont, the Warehouse District, and Colonel Arcade" As I am sure you are aware, as all of these areas became "cool" prices went up and most artists could not longer afford to be there.. The second thought process championed by DL Meckes and Bill Grulich are "sustainable art districts."

"Tremont, the Warehouse District, and Colonel Arcade" what fascinated me, was all three of these areas were created by Lakewoodites. That still live in Lakewood!

I would argue "then artists putting effort into creating a better and more cultured environment in Lakewood is a waste and time" is never a waste of time, and it is what artists(all forms) do. For in the entire history of art, rarely have artists and patrons lived together, especially in harmony. This is what Bill and DL's approach so interesting.

We are lucky to have artists like you, living here and taking part in this conversation, and the civilizing through arts the city of Lakewood.

.

[Ed FitzGerald]

Jim-

I think you're getting way too accusatory about this whole thing, and I think it's counterproductive for our city.

For example, I went to the Arts District meeting a couple years back. I recall absolutely no discussion of "tolerating artists" so that we could have "big box stores."

Yes, there are certainly possible economic spinoff effects of a successful Arts District, but you seem to be trying to set up a straw man which pits artists against big commercial development.

Baloney.

There is nothing conspiratorial or nefarious about discussing the economic benefits of the arts. The arts community rightfully uses that argument all the time when seeking taxpayer funding and support.

How about having a civil discussion about this topic instead of pretending that LakewoodAlive wants to start an Arts District as a way to attract WalMart?

[Jim O'Bryan]

Mayor FitzGerald

Duly noted, but at the same time, it is not conspiratorial as much as I would say the nature of the beast.

In the overall vision as I am learning, that CDC by nature are the bridge between government and "Commercial Development." The nature of these groups is to foster and attract development.

Again, as I pointed out, what I got from the three examples and the discussion was. "Attract artists, then come cool coffee shops, then comes cool stores, then comes real development, and then viola hotels, malls, big box stores."

At no point did they discuss the facts that the higher prices then force out the artists. Why would this be discussed at a meeting trying to explain "art districts" and why we need to "attract artists." This would be like explaining to deer why we need to attract bambi in hunting season.

While it is not as evil as I might underline, the fact remains, very few artists ever can live next to patrons of the parts. This does not make either group evil, it again is a reality of the beast. One could also point out, that many, many artists benefit from buying low and selling high.

As I have said many times before, I would hate to see Lakewood bottom out, as Tremont, the Warehouse District did. Chick Holkamp bought I think 20 homes from the price of 1.5 homes in Lakewood, when he helped other Lakewoodites to jump start Tremont. I would hate to see that happen here.

Again nothing "conspiratorial or nefarious about discussing the economic benefits of the arts" in the public. Never said there was. But go back and look in the tape, it was always "attract artists, cool coffee shops, big box stores, hotels." It was not "building a sustainable arts district."

As you are the mayor of this city, and I value your opinion, and the hard work you are doing, including you work with the Board of LakewoodAlive, I will weigh my words a little more carefully, but my thoughts remain much the same.

As always thank you for coming in, explaining yourself and and the city's position and clarifying any misconceptions I may have fostered.

Also this meeting was way before the merger.
.

[chris richards]

Let's not forget too that "ilk" or, "their kind" often refers to homosexual populations. One thing I find curious is that we have the highest per capita population of gay people between New York and Chicago, Lakewood has over 100 some bars. None of them are gay bars though.

In order to go to a gay bar, you have to cross over W. 117th. There's three that I know of. Twist on Clifton, one on Detroit, and one on Lorain. I don't know this for sure, but have heard from several people that the city gives a hard time to owners looking to open gay bars. In my perception, it's very odd that there are simply no gay bars in this city, but three within less than a mile of its borders.