Obama wins Wisconsin

David Lay · Post by **David Lay** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 9:27 pm

That's 9 straight wins for Obama. It's not looking good for Hillary.

Ivor Karabatkovic · Post by **Ivor Karabatkovic** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:07 pm

Two years ago on February 25th, I received my US Citizenship. The very next day, February 26th, I spent two hours driving around trying to find a tri-C campus to hear a man by the name of Barack Obama speak.

I had read about the senator for a few months in advance of this rally, and wanted to hear what he had to say.

The man stood on the stage and was strong and confident. He didn't fail to impress.

I came home and posted on this forum that this man has a shot at becoming the next President of the United States. I was quickly shot down by cynics and know-it-alls, who quickly said "NO! there's no way!".

I stayed quiet. I laughed, laughed some more, and laughed until tears came out of my eyes, because in my gut I had a feeling that things would change. I had hope!

So I called the man who spoke on stage that night an articulate speaker. Yes, articulate. If you read the article, I mentioned how he inspired with his speech, how he charmed with his character. Still, no one believed me.

I remember Bret Calentine laughing at me for calling Obama a articulate speaker who inspired many. I won't forget it.

So here we are, one year later. Look how the tables have turned. With almost 300 delegates in the lead and 9 states in a row (probably 10 with Hawaii), this man is now uniting the nation through his speeches and is inspiring millions of young people to use their right to vote.

Man, I feel good today.

Bryan Schwegler · Post by **Bryan Schwegler** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:14 pm

Latest Ohio poll results:

http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_article.a ... ryid=83606

Ivor Karabatkovic · Post by **Ivor Karabatkovic** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:16 pm

Bret,

don't try to weasel out of this one!

http://lakewoodobserver.com/forum/viewt ... 86&start=0

Bret Callentine wrote:Uh Oh!

Did my eyes deceive me or did Ivor really call Obama "articulate" on page one!?!

Here come the lawsuits!

Jim, does the paper have a slush fund set aside for sensitivity training or do we need to all pitch in for the young lad?

all fun and jokes.
the sad thing is that I'll still get my butt kicked in bowling by you. That's unless we bowl at Madison Square Lanes. Then it's going to be a good battle!

Ivor Karabatkovic · Post by **Ivor Karabatkovic** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:20 pm

Bryan,

good link.

While Hillary has a fair chance of winning Ohio, I think Texas is a Obama state now.

IF the young vote shows up on March 4th or earlier, this will be very interesting.

It's funny that Hillary had her rally today in Youngstown, a factory town, which lost jobs and factories because of NAFTA which was created by the Clinton Administration.

If you're for keeping NAFTA around, vote for Hillary. If you're not, vote for Barack. If you don't care, wake up and get educated.

Bryan Schwegler · Post by **Bryan Schwegler** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:25 pm

We'll see Ivor....

Hispanics have so far proven to be pretty anti-Obama. If that holds in Texas, he can't win.

I predict Hillary to win Ohio and most likely PA. I will also give her TX.

In the end, it will end up coming down to the Super Delegates. Neither will have enough total delegates to be the clear winner. It will be interesting to see what they end up doing.

While I like Obama, I still think he's the weaker candidate against McCain and that's what worries me.

Ivor Karabatkovic · Post by **Ivor Karabatkovic** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 10:34 pm

I just saw this while watching CNN tonight.

63% of people think that Obama is more electable and more likely to beat McCain in the general election compared to 37% that Hillary has.

I want Obama to be the Democratic Candidate because he is against NAFTA, and I have a feeling that his health care plan will cost less per household than Hillary's "Universal" health care plan.

A salesman will sell you the extra warranty on a expensive purchase, but won't tell you what isn't covered until that something happens and you call a third party warranty company. I think that's what Hillary is up to. She's saying "EVERYONE should be covered!" and hoping people catch on to the universal part of the health care, only to backfire on us once it's in place.

Obama's plan on the other hand I think would be less per household, and it would cover kids longer until they're 25 and out of college. That for me makes all the difference. I think that saves a household more money just for extending it to 25 years of age.

Ivor Karabatkovic · Post by **Ivor Karabatkovic** » Tue Feb 19, 2008 11:11 pm

This Article

explains where the race is at this very moment.

Brad Hutchison · Post by **Brad Hutchison** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 12:02 am

Bryan,

I think you'd have a hard time finding a poll that indicates Hillary being more electable versus McCain. Everything I've seen has Obama polling 7 or 8 points higher vs. McCain than Clinton does. Why? Because independents would break for McCain vs. Hillary, but for Obama vs. McCain.

http://www.realclearpolitics.com/epolls/2008/president/national.html

She's still likely to win Ohio, by all indications, but not by a lot. Obama is chipping away at her base (look at Wisconsin) and he picked up 2 big union endorsements, including medical professionals.

NOTE: I don't mean this to sound anti-Clinton, just from a politics standpoint, these are the facts that I've seen.

Bryan Schwegler · Post by **Bryan Schwegler** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:14 am

Brad and Ivor,
I don't disagree what the polls say right now, people claim Obama is more electable. However...

It's easy to say you'd vote one way in a theoretical matchup when the two candidates have not yet begun to campaign against each other let alone even have debated.

IMO, in a general election when the debates and attacks start, I think Hillary would be a much stronger candidate against McCain. If Obama wins the nomination, I'll definitely support him, I just think he'll have a much harder time than is being portrayed right now.

I don't buy the hype that he'll easily win over McCain. I don't see how anyone can claim that when the two haven't even had any type of interaction at this point.

Second, my issue is if he does get elected, are all those people who are currently enamored by his message of hope and expecting so much change going to be disappointed when he can't deliver it because of the realities of working with a closely split congress and a right-leaning Supreme Court? Does that make him more vulnerable to winning a second term?

I just fear the "mythos" of Obama that's been created and I think people are completely underestimating McCain.

Ivor Karabatkovic · Post by **Ivor Karabatkovic** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 10:49 am

Bryan,

all it takes is a licensing deal with CBS for Obama to beat McCain. Have them borrow a clip of McCain visiting David Letterman on the Late Show this past summer (I believe) when he was saying that this war is a mess, it's a mistake, we should change our strategy and President Bush screwed our country up in many, many ways.

That's all it takes.

Goodbye conservative votes, goodbye presidency.

Right before I started following politics, I saw his appearance there and I thought he was a Democrat. And now he's saying we can stay in Iraq for the next 100 years and he needs the conservative voters to vote for him!

McCain isn't that hard to beat, he's flip floppin' every time he says something conservative.

Brad Hutchison · Post by **Brad Hutchison** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:14 am

Bryan, those are all very valid points. But I think the only chance the Republicans have of winning is if McCain runs against someone who will drive voters to them. Of the Big 3 in this election, Hillary is the only one with an army of people who would never vote for her. I'm not saying that's justified, but it's true. The Clinton's polarize.

Regarding your point about bringing campaign promises to fruition, you're absolutely right, but I think that applies equally to everyone. Since we're not electing totalitarian dictators, all campaign promises are essentially empty. But I believe Obama, and even McCain, have a better chance of being uniters in Washington. If Hillary wins, the Republicans will just line up opposite her.

Bryan Schwegler · Post by **Bryan Schwegler** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:02 pm

Ivor Karabatkovic wrote:McCain isn't that hard to beat, he's flip floppin' every time he says something conservative.

Ivor my friend, how I do hope you're right in that statement.

I think however that McCain will turn out to be a much more dangerous opponent than you think. Especially given his appeal to moderates and independents.

Ivor Karabatkovic · Post by **Ivor Karabatkovic** » Wed Feb 20, 2008 4:34 pm

Obama is the candidate that independents support more then Hillary.

Shouldn't we elect the candidate that is just as appealing or more appealing than McCain to independents?

I know of many republicans that were stuck between Romney and Obama. Conservatives don't have a problem with voting for Obama; Hillary is another story.

Brad Hutchison · Post by **Brad Hutchison** » Thu Feb 21, 2008 12:33 am

A friend of mine - a life long Republican - just sent me a text telling me that he was leaning toward Obama and he wondered if that made him a commie.

This brings up something I've been thinking about lately, namely the Superdelegates. It seems to me that they exist to "override" the popular vote - if necessary - in favor of the candidate the party deems most electable. Or do they have a responsibility to follow their state's popular vote? Thoughts?