City Charter Change Petition

[Danielle Masters]

That depends entirely on who shows up to speak and why they are there.

If you spend a lot of time at council meetings, you may develop a different opinion.

I also don't necessarily want to sit through every comment before council gets down to important, "less interesting" issues.

And like Jeff, I hate to think that there are no citizens sitting in watching council at work.

Important decisions are made during boring meetings, like the committee of the whole or budget hearings. These boring meetings are open to the public, but the public usually doesn't show up.

Citizens usually only shows up when something "interesting" happens.

It's a real shame.

Just for the record I do attend a lot of council meetings. And I don't find them boring at all. I feel like its my civic duty to be involved and to be aware of what is going on in our city. I know many people don't feel that way are discouraged even more by having to sit through the entire meeting. I have seen people just give up and walk out, that is unfortunate and really doesn't help the democratic process.

[dl meckes]

I don't find them boring, either.

I'd still like to encourage flexibility in when citizen comments are allowed, rather than enforcing one or the other of our views which may not be appropriate in all situations.

[Lynn Farris]

Jeff, I could not agree with you more. I have been a big advocate of televising council meetings so that everyone that wants to be a part can participate, people who work that night can even record it and watch it later. Senior citizens on cold nights don't have to risk coming out. People with babies can stay home. Parents with school age children can stay home and check the school work. It is amazing how few people have the luxury of being able to come to council meetings and when they do - they should be respected. Yes, yes, I have heard that some council people may play to the TV. To be quite honest, maybe they would or maybe they would work harder to meet their constituents needs.

I sat in every council meeting for approximately 2 years and I almost always stayed to the end. I was horrified at how council walked out when people were talking, played with their mics and played with what must have been some kind of video game or blackberry device. I was horrified at the total disrespect shown to our citizens - for the most part. Many people are totally intimidated by the council - which is how some of them seem to like it. Our city and our council should show RESPECT to the citizens who elected them and who are in effect their employers.

I would not make my boss wait hours to hear what the problem was while I conducted in many cases mundane but important business. I would listen to him/her first, figure out how best to help them and then complete the rest of my work.

With all that being said, I am very impressed with several people on the new council who do get it and seem to understand that this is one of the few forms where citizens have a right to be heard. That is why I thanked Ryan and I don't think he is alone. I think we have several other council people who respect the citizens they were elected to represent.

Additionally, I was extremely impressed by State Senator Tim Grendell and the way he made sure that every citizen that wanted to be heard in testimony at the state level was heard. The senators and representatives on his panel listened, took notes and asked questions. We need to incorporate that in our council meetins.

JMHO

[dl meckes]

Lynn-

One of the points I hear you and perhaps Danielle make is that when there are issues that attract a lot of citizen interest, the comment portion available to citizens at council is insufficient.

In some cases, there isn't enough time to have the public hearings that are necessary to air citizens' concerns and hold a council meeting on the same night. I think citizens are shortchanged in many circumstances.

I don't know if there is a mechanism in place to call public hearings that require council to attend. Should there be? What would trigger that?

[Danielle Masters]

In some cases, there isn't enough time to have the public hearings that are necessary to air citizens' concerns and hold a council meeting on the same night. I think citizens are shortchanged in many circumstances.

I don't know if there is a mechanism in place to call public hearings that require council to attend. Should there be? What would trigger that?

It's unfortunate that often times when special meetings are held council participation is next to nil. We do have a few council people that hold and/or come to many community meetings but we also have some that don't show their faces outside of regular council meetings. We need council people that listen their constituents. Unfortunately since we don't have that now the only place that citizens can voice their concerns to be heard by all of council is at council meetings. Honestly I don't need to attend anymore meetings than I already do and for the pay council receives I don't think they need to add more meetings to their schedules. I would simply like for citizens to be able to voice their concerns and be heard and given the respect they deserve which is not happening now.

[Danielle Masters]

One more thing that might help this issue is different council people. I really believe that the council members that ignore their constituents need to be replaced. I hope that in this next election we are able to elect representatives that will listen to the citizens and ACT! Just my two cents.

[Bryan Schwegler]

One more thing that might help this issue is different council people. I really believe that the council members that ignore their constituents need to be replaced. I hope that in this next election we are able to elect representatives that will listen to the citizens and ACT! Just my two cents.

I agree. I think entrenched political leadership is bad for everyone. We see it Congress, we saw it at the state level, and to be honest, Lakewood is no different.

Everyone burns out and some times we need fresh thinking, a new perspective.

This is especially so true when the situation arises that you mention...they forget to respect the people they serve.

[Lynn Farris]

DL, you are right and so are Bryan and Danielle.

Sometimes for special issues, we should have special meetings and for those of us that are lucky enough to have good council members (Kevin Butler is mine and he is great - so is Ryan and Mary Louise often attends too.) that will attend and listen.

But would the skatepark have been built if many people hadn't shown up at city hall to lend their support? If it had been a quiet little meeting - would enough pressure had been brought to bear? I don't know - but luckily that was before they changed comments until the end of the meeting. It is possible that some of the skaters wouldn't have been allowed to stay out that late.

But I was thinking back to the hundreds of problems I have heard. For example, I remember a night a few years ago, where one man came about the sewers backing up on his street, another told them about being cited for not having trash lids which the trash collectors lost - and he was unemployed and he couldn't buy just a trash lid - but needed to buy a whole new trash can because the stores didn't sell just lids - and it was that or food for his family (Nancy Roth - offered a deal to get him a new trash can.) Another person had problems with stray cats in her yard. All problems that were important to those people. (I remember these 3 well because Don had woven all 3 into a story about the cats knocking the trash lids into the sewer causing the sewer problems - while we were waiting for something else.) These are the people that don't want to learn the intricacies of municipal government - they just want their sewer working, not to be in trouble about their trash lids and not to have stray cats in their yard. They don't want to wait hours - to have their problems addressed. They are the ones that don't have the luxury to wait around all night.

Please let council help these people by allowing the open comments at the begining of the night instead of making them wait until 11:00 or 12:00.

[Lynn Farris]

Bryan and Danielle,

You bring up some interesting points. We did look at them during the Charter Review - and there were not enough votes to change it. But should the council and mayor be term limited?

I'd be curious to see what everyone thinks.

[Danielle Masters]

But should the council and mayor be term limited?

Yes, I think they should be.