Elections...

[Mark Crnolatas]

That "extreme" is what potentially lies out there. Does the L.O then make policy as to what it would and would not support? Who would define that policy and would it be made public before any articles would be written?

This obviously is a complex facet the LO is looking at. It seems the LO has grown from a politically based posting board to a concept factory which the community that knows it, looks to it, as its only newspaper source, which we ourselves tout as open source, everyone is welcome, we do not hold grudges, we discuss anything without censorship etc.

I'm wondering whether this now respectable newspaper/website should get into picking and choosing, such as which topics to allow, which to not allow. That one concept alone, goes against many postings by Jim, dl, and the rest of the crew that brings this entity every other week, from concept to reality.

The simple question: What would be allowed, and what would not be allowed? No discourse on partial birth abortions if it did come up? Yes or no to same sex marriage? Death penalty.
Does the L.O. want to begin to pick and choose, when we all take pride that it has evolved to be a truly free expression project only limited by who wants to say their piece?

Mark Allan Crnolatas
Musican

[Jim O'Bryan]

Mark

I think your entire premise is flawed and we have spoken about this many times.

The Observation Deck is apolitical, it is an inanimate object. That said a large percentage of the users lean to the left. This is nothing more than a reflection of the city which is also heavily democratic.

This year it will be intersting, as I mentioned members of the board, are working on campaigns from many people running. Two I know are on opposite sides of races. This will not be a problem, as we rarely agree on anything anyway. Which is why I love having the board we do, each one brings a different perspective.

As you know and every Republican on the board and in the city knows. When I can find one I beg them to take part, I beg them to write for the paper, I beg them to be a part of the process. I believe that both Bret Callentine and Kate Parker would agree with this. As would Collen Wing, Tex Phillips, Jennifer Scott and Ryan Patrick Demro.

If they choose not to post, I am not going to post for them.

Look at the first hundred members of the Deck. These are some of the best participants from both sides of the most divisive issue of all time in Lakewood. The reason they signed on was trust for the project AND, that if we could get everyone to ONE table to discuss Lakewood and where it is going that ALL of us would agree on 80% of what is going on and how to address these issues. We would work on those, then get back to the tough ones. Everyday I sign in and see Suzanne Metelko's name in line with Lynn Farris' name it makes me smile, it gives me hope.

The secret is one all inclusive table with everyone using one name and taking ownership of their ideas and comments. This concept runs through everything we do. I think you will love the new sections we are bringing onboard.

While you can bend this as you wish, the fact remains it is the participants that define the board and the paper, not the board or myself.

Thanks for taking part.

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[Danielle Masters]

I agree with Mark. I say give both sides of the issues a chance to express their views. I think that I can decide on my own how I will vote, even when it comes down to non-partisan issues such as bonds and levies. I wouldn't like the paper to take sides on an issue like the West End Project if anything like that came up again. While I doubt we will be deciding anything like abortion at a city levels, we will be asked to vote on state wide issues and I do hope they are covered in the paper. I am sure that in such a diverse city as Lakewood we will be able to find two people to give different sides of an issue. I would hope that we can all be trusted to make up our own minds on issues if given both sides. I really don't need my home town paper to tell me how to vote, especially since I will probably disagree with most of you. That's just my two cents.

[Mark Crnolatas]

Well, there are the hard-core Democrats, who will endorse anything that the party as a whole endorses. There are the hard-core Republicans who do the same on the right side, endorsing radical ideology just because it is part of the party's decisions. There are also people from either party who lean toward the center but still keep a foot in their party's doorway.
Then there are free-thinkers, who have quit associations with either party, as far as being a "card carrying member", because they are just that, free thinkers aka Independents.

I suppose I just stated the obvious. Don't mind me.
By the way, being in the middle and evaluating issues and candidates for who and what they are, ignoring their party ties, doesn't make a person a fence-rider. It simple states that person thinks independently of either "club" or party. (I just through that in for a certain lurker I know who reads but doesn't post here).


Mark Allan Crnolatas
Musician

[Jim O'Bryan]

I agree with Mark. I say give both sides of the issues a chance to express their views.

Danielle/Mark

So if the paper opens it doors to writers, and a majority of them come from the left, as the city is very heavily democratic, you will not complain?

or

Is it better than we let the candidates voice their views, amplify them, and let residents make up their minds?

One problem I have and I am getting tired of is the thought that the paper is democratic. It is not. But I cannot get the Republicans to put it up. Brett Callentine has, but is an Independent I think. Kate Parker did.

You have no idea how frustrating it is, when every R I find, or for that matter every I I beg to write, and they never get it to the paper. Colleen Wing wanted our political writer to cover the Republican club after he wrote about the Democratic Club. I mentioned that Tom Bullock is a member of the Democrats, and would not be the best to write about the Republicans. She understood and I am still waiting for the story.

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[Mark Crnolatas]

I, for one, will not complain. My political stance is as far from both parties as possible. I see many negatives on both sides if the isle, from corruption to special interests contributing mass amounts, on and on, so I choose to evaluate each issue and each person on it's/own merit, and ignore what party they are with, unless the party is using them as a puppet, and I hope I'll be able to make an educated guess on that aspect too.

It seems difficult to get across that concept on here, that a person can be so frustrated with both Democrats and Republicans, that the person chooses to use their vote on issues and people, rather than who belongs to which side, left or right.

Regarding those people and issues, I'd be willing to write and state my views on the various issues, and various candidates, especially on the national level, but without any party sticker behind my name.


Mark Allan Crnolatas
Musician and Independent, supporting neither party, but exercising my right to vote for who and what I believe is good for our country.

[Bret Callentine]

It's a tricky issue. In the end, regardless of whether it is an election year or not, the paper will always probably have a more democratic slant to it, but that is not because of any deliberate act, it's merely a reflection of the population.

The best thing the paper can do is not apologize for it.

It's true, the whole reason I ended up here is because I was tired of only seeing one side of the coin in the OP-ED section. Jim probably STILL has scars on his ears from my first heated phone call. But to his credit, he simply said, "you want a different view, fine, you write it and we'll print it"

And what do you know, he did.

Just tell the Republicans to put up or shut up.

As long as any political piece is properly labeled as OPINION and not NEWS, I see no problem with putting it all in.

As for me, personally, I've got no problem if there is a numerical imbalance.

[Jim O'Bryan]

It's true, the whole reason I ended up here is because I was tired of only seeing one side of the coin in the OP-ED section. Jim probably STILL has scars on his ears from my first heated phone call. But to his credit, he simply said, "you want a different view, fine, you write it and we'll print it"

And what do you know, he did.

Brett

Nothing I had not heard before.

You my friend are one of the rare ones.

Thanks



.

[Mark Crnolatas]

Jim, remember when I was supporting Bush on the Buzz, we had some heated exchanges then. After the birth of the L.O., for a time, I still supported Bush, and if there are archives, you can see that many people jumped on me, and some were far from polite.

Coming from 30+ yrs of being a staunch Democrat, I held my ground until events changed, time changed, people changed, and I no longer could give my support to the Republican party, nor the Democrat party who I blindly supported for years.

In stating that here, I was jumped on, again, far from politely, from several people, told that being a "centrist" was "a Republican's way" of disavowing Bush, and other comments even more crude, and I admitted that maybe I didn't have a "thick enough skin to post on here", regarding such matters. This not only applied to me, but most everyone who was supporting Bush received the same type of verbal bashing.

Again, events changed, the LO has become much more civil, the posters now seem to avoid flame wars and insults completely, but I know more than one person who told me they would no longer post here during those heated times.

For myself, I am clearly and 100% Independent, and would write an article (s) supporting a Democrat rooted viewpoint or candidate if I deemed it something that needed to be said, or Republican rooted viewpoint or candidate, if too, I deemed it needed to be said, as I am coming from both sides in the past. I'd like to think Woody's are civil enough to accept a viewpoint from someone who doesn't carry a card from either party.

This might be one reason you can't get a Republican to either write much or post much on here. The memories of that time might still be in their minds. There was some rocky times then. I would liken it to either Bush speaking at the Democratic National Convention or Hillary speaking at the Republican one.

Any comment from a Republican who has not posted on here for awhile but lurks? I know your out there

Mark Allan Crnolatas
Musician and....the rest of it.

[Danielle Masters]

I have to say that at times it can be frustrating being a republican in a democrat town. It can be tough defending your views when you know you will get lots of negativity. I should be more open about my views but honestly sometimes I really don't want to devote the time to defending my beliefs over and over again. That is why I rarely post on the global discussion threads, heck I rarely read them. I don't know for certain why the other republicans don't post or write often but I would imagine their feelings are similar to mine. Speaking for myself it's maddening when you give time and devote yourself to worthy causes only to have people call you awful things when you speak your mind about politics. It's rude and it turns people off. That's my opinion for what it is worth.

[Mark Reinhold]

Good, bad or indifferent.

The paper is a democratic paper.

In print announcement of Dennis' presidential campaign the SAME day he officially announced in person. The paper was the first in the nation to officially announce the candidate. That is arrogantly democratic. Not because it supports Dennis but because you wanted to prove your "inside stature" by printing early. Everyone knew he would run but no one would print it until Dennis actually said something. I picked up the paper and skimmed it while listening to Dennis on the radio.

Two to three page "educational" editorials on a regular basis. Always slanted left.

Saving a small home is presented as a cause not as a potential way to make money...The owner of the home told me that he was never interviewed (hearsay?) left slanted.

Even in your own party there is a slant... Ed Fitzgerald's announcement on the front page top.... But had to be followed by 3 achievements by George under the fold. I took this as not letting Ed gain any traction... not being fair and balanced. The recent crime wasn't printed as a bad thing ... I think the paper compared Tom George to a super hero (paper or post?)

The Plain Dealer is predominately democratic... Cleveland is mostly democratic... Lakewood representation is all democratic... thus the paper is mostly democratic.

This is not a bad thing it's just real... Any one that watches Fox news the same way they watch Tim Russert isn't consuming news with their eyes open.

Declare your favorites. The paper is a editorial paper ... how can it be anything else? It's written written by citizens not reporters... its written with rose colored glasses (who paints an ugly "brand")

The paper is supported by democrats please the clients.

[Bryan Schwegler]

... Lakewood representation is all democratic...

Ryan Demro is a Republican. Not all of Lakewood's government is Democratic.

[Colleen Wing]

Gee, I guess I should chime in on this one.

For the record, I submitted two articles to the Observer during the '05 election and heard nothing back.

I could write a hundred articles about why I believe in this issue or where the Party stands on that issue but is that really what you are looking for? A few months back I opened up the LO and saw a full page article written about the problems with Conservatives written by a man who's disdain for them was dripping from the page. What was the purpose of that article?

That article and Jim's unnatural affection for Dennis Kucinich really made me rethink participating in The LO at all. That being said.

I asked about a comparable feature about the Lakewood Republican Organization because it was covered as a story. You know, when the person is a reporter. At least that was my understanding.

I would love to participate in a yin/yang, tomato/tamato, red/blue article in the political area of the paper. I am not a reporter, you can call it a cop out (and I am sure you will) but give me a topic of interest and I will write about it.

This is how we (Jim and I) have been running around this topic for two years. If you want to see something in the paper than submit something, Gee, Jim what do you want me to write about, Whatever you want. And here we are again. I have people who would like to write for the LO and their first question to me is "What should I write about?" and I say - If I knew that, I would be doing it. To some extent is a self fulfilling prophecy.
By the way, I got an A in Political Science and a C in English- we will see where that gets us.

Maybe you all could throw out some topics to help me out, this just isn't my thing.

PS.
Regarding the Deck -The main reason I can't post whatever I want on this or any board or blog is because I am currently an elected official within the Ohio Republican Party. I actually out rank Demro within the Party... tee hee I LOVE to remind him of this.

[Jim O'Bryan]

IIt's true, the whole reason I ended up here is because I was tired of only seeing one side of the coin in the OP-ED section. Jim probably STILL has scars on his ears from my first heated phone call. But to his credit, he simply said, "you want a different view, fine, you write it and we'll print it"

And what do you know, he did.

Just tell the Republicans to put up or shut up.
.

Collen

I defend myself on the words of Bret Callentine, and EVERY WRITER in the Observer. I have never told anyone what to write. The only time it came close was I suggested to Justine Cooper to write about a store that was having trouble. She said no, "you promised me I could write what I wanted."

Bret Callentine called me and said "You might not like my next article, it is about Dennis Kucinich." My answer was, "It has your name on it not mine." He later called the day of the paper and asked how I liked it, my answer, "I have still not read it, I wanted no reason to stop it from being published."

While everyone thinks I control the paper nothing is farther from the truth. I see the paper for the final 12 hours, making sure ads are in, everything is lined up and ready for press. This time I set one article back. It was about a karate studio, written by a member. this issue we had a karate studio take out an ad. As the story was not time sensitive, and was more of an ad. I decided, the story could wait at least one issue.

I have never bumped a Colleen Wing story, to be honest I have never seen one. Was it submitted through the member center? That would be Heidi's territory not mine. But I will gladly take the fall for her or anyone that works on the paper. In the end the buck stops with me.

Or were the stories, story ideas. Colleen did call and ask for the person who wrote the story on the Democratic Party to write on the Republican Party. I assure her I was not part of the story, and that she did not want Tom Bullock to write it as he works for the Democratic Party. Tom also declined the invite for fear he could not do it justice.

As for the mention of Dennis Kucinich, my feelings are very public. For many reasons. 1) I like the man and find little fault with him. 2) The Kucinichs have become friends and I hate to see friends attacked over nothing. 3) So that everyone understand when I talk about the issue where I stand. I want no one saying I am secretly trying to do anything.

So Colleen what were the stories, and where were they submitted? Why would I tell you what to write when I have told no one what to write. If I had I fear we would be reading, "Then Jim told me to write about..." For me it is a no win situation. Gordon Brumm has a colmun, and Brett got his to offset the left, to be fair. Ask either, I am working on getting them on the same subject, just to be fair.

I have given to candidates from both parties.

Have to leave, but couldn't leave without this post.


.

[Kenneth Warren]

Colleen:

The LO is premised on a very radical (rootsy) notion of invitation, inclusion and innovation in the way local media and meaning are produced with the intended total effect being that people feel better about Lakewood with the paper rather than without the paper. To that limited extent, the LO project is succeeding.

Neither the politicians nor the parties seem equipped to harness the power of the new tool. I believe the candidate that does will win the local election.

Perhaps it's a control the message mandate that recoils from the wild cards that will inevitably be dealt in such a new experiment. That's fine. Simply acknowledge the project cannot serve the party and the agents bound to its premises. Don't mis-characterize the intentions of the LO project, simply on the basis of what is emerging from the voices so far.

From the outset, the analogy of open source was used to describe the evolution of the Lakewood code we hoped would be written by our citizens. Under the open source analogy, each person or political complex of persons needs to pop their own kernels of self-organized expression, so to speak. Those kernels of self-organized expression are then entered into the Lakewood open source code. Sometimes we say, “Put up or shut up.â€Â