What would compromise look like?

[Dan Alaimo]

Since that cold, dark night in January when the Mayor and friends disclosed their plan, much has been said, millions have been spent, and the CCF plan has not changed much at all, while SLH and other opponents have dug in with increasingly frustrated rhetoric. To acknowledge, the CCF plan has changed some: instead of a major outpatient center, it is now a building across the street that combines two existing CCF Lakewood offices (they will close) with some kind of medical clinic for some minor emergency needs. The parking structure goes away and a six acre commercial development takes the place of the hospital. Meanwhile the conversation has become more and more heated with hardly anyone listening to what the other side has to say.

The question I raise is, what if some form of compromise was proposed? What would it look like? What if the City were able to get a better deal from CCF or, more likely, some other health care organization?

Of course a continuation of hospital services like Metro proposed - and the City ignored - would be a no-brainer. But are there other options?

For instance, what if they proposed a full service outpatient clinic with nearly every service a hospital offers minus the beds, with a true emergency room operating at some level of the trauma center scale (1-5)? What if they did that along with a few beds to accommodate overnight cases?

That's not my plan, but I'm just asking: is there room for compromise, or is this a fight to the death? The death of one or the other plans, and possibly, as Brian Essi has pointed out, the unnecessary deaths of Lakewood residents.

[Don Schmitz]

I think a good compromise would be a brand new 125-150 bed in-patient hospital, paid for by the Clinic, whether through a judgment in the lawsuit or by the action of the Clinic (to get out of the lawsuit without damaging their reputation any further). That would be akin to what they told us they would do years ago before they came up with the secret plan to decant the hospital.

Doesn't seem like too much to ask.

[Corey Rossen]

Hypothetical - What if the hospital stays and someone dies during a medical procedure? Would all following malpractice cases fall under the Save Lakewood umbrella? Does that mean that Save Lakewood is killing people?

Please note - I am still on the fence about all of this.

Corey

[Dan Alaimo]

When I started this thread I hoped, but didn't expect, someone from BL would suggest something.
Again, crickets.

Corey, I'm not sure what you are asking, and I would defer to a legal expert in any case. How could an unrelated advocacy group be responsible for something that might happen in the future if the hospital remained open? Are you relating that eventuality to the conversation here about death rates?

[Corey Rossen]

I am just trying to figure out the flip side. I keep hearing that demolishing the hospital adds ambulance reaction time and kills people - I understand where that is coming from. The flip side of that would be, in my interpretation, if the hospital stays, needs renovations, upgrades, etc and somebody passes away - are we to blame the people who wanted to keep it?

That would seem to be the way the other advocacy side might see it? Maybe I am just looking at this wrong.

Corey

[Paul Schrimpf]

Corey --

It took a few years to degrade the services, so theoretically they could not be returned to full strength with the flick of a switch. You wouldn't see the hospital taking on more than it could handle before it's ready, were it to be put back on a path to being a full service hospital.

Paul

[Corey Rossen]

Paul -

To what degree have the services been degraded? Are they staffing less specialists or other medically necessary people? Is equipment outdated or faulty? Are renovations needed just cosmetic or medically necessary? Etc.

I keep hearing that staff is being sent to other facilities. Is that due to excessive staffing? They got rid of equipment that relates to these medical positions? Etc.

There are so many questions still lingering about how to come up with a personal decision.

Corey

[Brian Essi]

I am just trying to figure out the flip side. I keep hearing that demolishing the hospital adds ambulance reaction time and kills people - I understand where that is coming from. The flip side of that would be, in my interpretation, if the hospital stays, needs renovations, upgrades, etc and somebody passes away - are we to blame the people who wanted to keep it?

That would seem to be the way the other advocacy side might see it? Maybe I am just looking at this wrong.

Corey

You're kidding aren't you?

[Corey Rossen]

I am just trying to figure out the flip side. I keep hearing that demolishing the hospital adds ambulance reaction time and kills people - I understand where that is coming from. The flip side of that would be, in my interpretation, if the hospital stays, needs renovations, upgrades, etc and somebody passes away - are we to blame the people who wanted to keep it?

That would seem to be the way the other advocacy side might see it? Maybe I am just looking at this wrong.

Corey

You're kidding aren't you?

Sure, I must be drunk on Ripple, right?

Corey

[Brian Essi]

I am just trying to figure out the flip side. I keep hearing that demolishing the hospital adds ambulance reaction time and kills people - I understand where that is coming from. The flip side of that would be, in my interpretation, if the hospital stays, needs renovations, upgrades, etc and somebody passes away - are we to blame the people who wanted to keep it?

That would seem to be the way the other advocacy side might see it? Maybe I am just looking at this wrong.

Corey

You're kidding aren't you?

Sure, I must be drunk on Ripple, right?

Corey

Or Mad Dog?

[Corey Rossen]

I am just trying to figure out the flip side. I keep hearing that demolishing the hospital adds ambulance reaction time and kills people - I understand where that is coming from. The flip side of that would be, in my interpretation, if the hospital stays, needs renovations, upgrades, etc and somebody passes away - are we to blame the people who wanted to keep it?

That would seem to be the way the other advocacy side might see it? Maybe I am just looking at this wrong.

Corey

You're kidding aren't you?

Sure, I must be drunk on Ripple, right?

Corey

Or Mad Dog?

Whatever you're pouring is fine with me.

Corey

[Bill Call]

When I started this thread I hoped, but didn't expect, someone from BL would suggest something.
Again, crickets.

The Mayor is Build Lakewood and the Mayors campaign is doing all it can to control the conversation. It has the advantage of the Clinic's deep pockets and the advantage of the reluctance of major media to examine the issues surrounding the behavior of the Clinic the LHA, LHF and the Mayor.

What would compromise look like? You are assuming that the Mayor wants health care in Lakewood. Someone at City Hall was asked about providing releases to other health care providers so they could present offers to the City. The reply was, "The Mayor only wants to deal with the Clinic."

So what's the deal?

The Clinic will close its two buildings on 117th and Detroit and on Madison.
The Clinic will close the family health center just south of the parking garage.
The City will demolish the medical office building on Detroit and Belle.

That's a loss of about 140,000 square feet of office space.

The Clinic will move all hospital related business to Avon and Fairview.

The City will pay to demolish the Hospital.
The City will pay to demolish the parking garage.
The City will pay to demolish the medical office building (88,000 square feet).
The City will pay to demolish all the homes owned by the Hospital.

The City will sell the office building in Westlake to the Clinic at a 50% discounted price.
The City will forgive $12 million in rent.
The City will grant the Clinic a release of liability for all of their past actions.
The City will end the law suit.
The City will pay to build and maintain a new 1 acre parking lot for the use of the Clinic.
The City will sell about 2 acres of land to the City at a 50% discount.
The City will end the discovery process.
The City will grant the Clinic a monopoly on health care in Lakewood.


The Lakewood Hospital Foundation will be repurposed as a Foundation to serve the health and wellness needs of the residents of Lakewood and , (according to Sean Juris)SURROUNDING COMMUNITIES.
The new Foundation will be controlled by the Clinic.

So what is the Clinic offering in return?

The Clinic will build a 62,000 medical office building that will house about 16 doctors and staff. How big is that? Picture the current medical office building on Detroit and Belle that is about 88,000 square feet. Think about it, now take away the top three floors. What's left will be the Lakewood Family Health Center.

The Clinic has refused to say what services and specialties will be offered and has refused to guarantee any level of service.

No wonder the Mayor and Build Lakewood refuse to defend the deal.

[Brian Essi]

When I started this thread I hoped, but didn't expect, someone from BL would suggest something.
Again, crickets.

The Mayor is Build Lakewood and the Mayors campaign is doing all it can to control the conversation. It has the advantage of the Clinic's deep pockets and the advantage of the reluctance of major media to examine the issues surrounding the behavior of the Clinic the LHA, LHF and the Mayor.

What would compromise look like? You are assuming that the Mayor wants health care in Lakewood. Someone at City Hall was asked about providing releases to other health care providers so they could present offers to the City. The reply was, "The Mayor only wants to deal with the Clinic."

So what's the deal?

The Clinic will close its two buildings on 117th and Detroit and on Madison.
The Clinic will close the family health center just south of the parking garage.
The City will demolish the medical office building on Detroit and Belle.

That's a loss of about 140,000 square feet of office space.

The Clinic will move all hospital related business to Avon and Fairview.

The City will pay to demolish the Hospital.
The City will pay to demolish the parking garage.
The City will pay to demolish the medical office building (88,000 square feet).
The City will pay to demolish all the homes owned by the Hospital.

The City will sell the office building in Westlake to the Clinic at a 50% discounted price.
The City will forgive $12 million in rent.
The City will grant the Clinic a release of liability for all of their past actions.
The City will end the law suit.
The City will pay to build and maintain a new 1 acre parking lot for the use of the Clinic.
The City will sell about 2 acres of land to the City at a 50% discount.
The City will end the discovery process.
The City will grant the Clinic a monopoly on health care in Lakewood.


The Lakewood Hospital Foundation will be repurposed as a Foundation to serve the health and wellness needs of the residents of Lakewood and , (according to Sean Juris)SURROUNDING COMMUNITIES.
The new Foundation will be controlled by the Clinic.

So what is the Clinic offering in return?

The Clinic will build a 62,000 medical office building that will house about 16 doctors and staff. How big is that? Picture the current medical office building on Detroit and Belle that is about 88,000 square feet. Think about it, now take away the top three floors. What's left will be the Lakewood Family Health Center.

The Clinic has refused to say what services and specialties will be offered and has refused to guarantee any level of service.

No wonder the Mayor and Build Lakewood refuse to defend the deal.[/quote!

Just the Facts.

Nothing but the facts.

[Dan Alaimo]

It's now been several days since the long weekend. Does anyone aligned with Build Lakewood or the City or LHA have anything to offer?