Calling all non-smokers and smokers

[Bryan Schwegler]

I still do not remember many people saying, "If you ban smoking and increase marketing you might stay in business."

For the record, I believe I said pretty much that very thing in the giant debate thread before the law was even passed.

[Justine Cooper]

Jim,
The fact that people can't afford to vacation now with rising gas and thus food prices, is directly related to the same cause of why they are not going out to eat or drink as much. I do think the economy has a bigger effect than the smoking ban, otherwise wouldn't all the VA people be eating out at the beaches? We didn't even eat out but a few times during two weeks in that area, and even cooking was wicked expensive with the cost of groceries. We didn't go out drinking there either. I just think one of first luxuries to go when money is tight is eating out. I do agree to support the local restaurants whenever we get that craving though and Melts, Coffee Pot, La Pita, and the others mentioned are worth the money any day.

[Justine Cooper]

Personally, I know that I no longer go to my favorite local bar... not because of the smoking ban, but because they tore it down to build another drug store.

Curious. Has anyone done any follow up research on the results of the smoking ban? Are we all suddenly healthier? Has the healthcare savings met the loss in business? Do we just automatically assume that the ban had the desired effect and leave it in place for the rest of eternity? Or can it be re-visited? I wonder what the results would be if it had to pass another vote to remain.

One of the groups of people the ban was trying to help was those in the service industry who had no other choice but that employment, who for years inhaled second hand smoke while serving/working in bars and restaurants. When I was younger you could walk around a mall or sit on a plane and light up. Imagine that now, sitting in a plane and someone lighting up a cigarette next to your child. They started banning smoking in other areas years ago and finally got around to other public places because of the fact that second hand smoke is directly linked to cancer. If people choose to drink or eat products that can cause cancer, it is their personal choice. If they smoke around others though, they are making that choice for others. There are many children and adults with asthma who deserve to go out without breathing in second hand smoke. Let's not forget the many walking around with cancer or other illnesses who shouldn't have to breathe in cigarrette smoke when they are out to eat. We wouldn't revisit a ban on lead paint. Smokers I know, including my husband, have no problem going outside to smoke, at home and other places. He said it wouldn't affect going out or not, but I know a study of hundreds or thousands would be a valid study.

[chris richards]

Advertising is not the only marketing these places can do. Case in point: Restaurant of the Weekend

A place originally known for beers, now getting press about the food being served.

[James Mullen]

In my paying career, and education I too amazingly have a degree in PR/Communications and am currently working in development.....that all being said you can market till the cows come home. If the smoking ban has now real way to be enforced, which it doesnt then there is going to be places smokers can go to drink, eat and smoke just as they could nearly two years ago. This is my biggest problem with the ban, good law, but the way to enforce the law is very poor. There are establishments right her in Lakewood that currently allow their patrons to smoke, there are also plenty on the near westside as well as some suburbs, this is a reality and it is happening because the State of Ohio has no idea how to enforce this law.

We just added a pation about a month ago to combat the smoking laws, it has helped but it is not a catch all, it is going to take time for people to realize we have one. I again would echo what has already been said chose Lakewood, every chance you get.

[Charyn Compeau]

While I would agree that the decrease in patronage is an industry-wide issue and not only evident in Lakewood, James has a VERY important point.

As an ex-smoker I can tell you with absolute certainty that if I were presented with the choice of a RR bar that would let me smoke and the local place I've been going to or the last 10 years, I would choose the place that would let me smoke.

I was an addict - as are all nicotine users. And the addiction demands its due.

Now as a non-smokers i can also tell you that I do go to bars more than I used to, but my overall budget is much much less due to the rising energy costs. Even now, in the middle of summer, I am saving my pennies for this coming winter's heating.

To be effective the law has to be enforced. Consistently.

Otherwise it WILL be the responsible bar owners that suffer.

Always,
Charyn

[Brad Hutchison]

So, to turn to a more constructive vein: Which Lakewood "bars" have the best food? My favorites, in no particular order...

Beer Engine
Melt
Pacers
Drink Cafe
Around the Corner
West End Tavern
Sullivan's

What else? (Sorry James, I don't know if Mullen's serves food or not.)

[Shannon Hoffman]

I am almost afraid to say this, so please remember, don't kill the messenger....


It seems to me that besides just patronizing local eateries/bars, the best thing that Lakewoodites could do would be to level the playing field by reporting places that continue to flaunt breaking the anti-smoking ban laws by looking the other way to gain an unfair advantage in business. It sounds like the patio at Mullens has been helpful, but multiple times decreased business was blamed on other businesses that continue to look the other way and allow smoking. We are blaming laws that are not being enforced, but how many lakewoodites are a witness to these activities and not reporting them? Aren't they just as much or more to blame for these other businesses potentially closing than people that aren't going out to eat because money is tight?


FWIW, I can feed my family of 6 dinner at home, purchased from local Lakewood stores, that I walked to, my community garden and LEAF/Cityfresh for less than ONE reasonably priced entree from a local eatery. Should I feel guilty because I choose to do that and BTW am not a smoker? I don't think so. I am very sorry that some businesses aren't doing well right now. I must commend Phoenix and Rozi's for being so well represented at walk +roll. I was impressed by their efforts and now know more about what these local businesses offer. Where were the local bars at during the event? They could have hosted an Irish drinking song contest or best "Priest, minister and a rabbi walk into a bar" joke contest, or featured other advertising for their wonderful menu at that event. I have young kids and don't go out drinking much, so I am unaware of who even sells good food. That would have been a way to give back to Lakewood and provided marketing to some demographics that you aren't hitting by advertising in local entertainment guides.

[ryan costa]

Are you allowed to take your drink with you when you go outside the bar to smoke?

[Jim DeVito]

No

[Brad Hutchison]

Only in an enclosed space, i.e. a patio.

[Shawn Juris]

I can't help but to follow the lead on this one, I apologize if it was already mentioned but I wasnt' able to read through all the posts on this thread.

Support your local economy... visit a local bar. Not sure when to do it, well we've got you covered. Not sure about which place you want to check out first, got you covered. Don't want to drive between places or worried about parking, got you covered. August 23rd from 1pm to 7pm. For a VIP pass costing just $15 you get a chance to eat 6 wings at each of our participating locations, transportation between locations and a chance to cast your ballot for the best wings in Lakewood. Tickets are available online at www.pillarsoflakewood.com/shop.aspx. For an extra $5 shirts are available which will sport the wing logo along with "Support your local economy. visit a bar today" with the names of each of our locations.

If the idea of eating nearly 75 wings in a day has you feeling not so fit, then start the day with a 5K at Lakewood Park. Proceeds from the 5K will go towards providing recycling bins for Lakewood High School. Registration for the 5K can be completed at www.clevelandplays.com/Events.aspx or email Pillars at info@pillarsoflakewood.com.

[Ahmie Yeung]

For nearly the same price you can get a better burger from the WestEnd, Around the Corner, Coffee Pot, or others than you can from McDonalds.

Go one step further to The Place to be and/or Mahalls and they are less than McDonalds.
.

But will my 4yr old enjoy it as much as McDonalds? The problem is that McD's has the play area to keep him quiet and a toy accompanies the meal (yes, I would be quite happy to have less plastic junk coming home with us, but he's 4 and doesn't quite understand that yet).

Dianna's on 117th earned loyalty from us on our first visit there about a week ago by how well they treated our son. They immediately offered a coloring page (torn out of a real coloring book) and crayons and were exceptionally kind and understanding about food accomodations for our baby who is cutting 5 teeth at the moment (our waitress rushed out a plate of steamed broccoli for him). The only real complaint I have is that the burger from the kids menu was WAY too big, but as complaints go that's a rare one and next time we'll just share an adult plate with our 4yr old instead.

Bella Dubby is also extremely kid-friendly and we appreciate it (tho don't go there as often as we could - it's too far for us to walk and parking is an issue in the area).

We're making an effort to visit non-chain places more often, but also keep in mind that many chains are actually individually owned franchises (IHOP and Applebee's often are), and their overhead is likely even more odd than an individual restaurant that can swap things off the menu quite easily if they become cost prohibitive in the region.

As to the smokers, it's not really much of an improvement having them clustered around the entrance under an overhang - I'm asthmatic and walking through the smoke to enter the establishment can quickly be deemed not worth the trouble when I have to walk through a crowd of smokers to get there. One person's rights end when they start trampling on the rights of another. My and my children's right to breathe exceeds a smoker's right to smoke in a particular spot. That is the spirit of the law.

[Ahmie Yeung]

If the idea of eating nearly 75 wings in a day has you feeling not so fit, then start the day with a 5K at Lakewood Park. Proceeds from the 5K will go towards providing recycling bins for Lakewood High School. Registration for the 5K can be completed at www.clevelandplays.com/Events.aspx or email Pillars at info@pillarsoflakewood.com.

Just gotta say it, Shawn - you are my hero of the day for advertising this. I hadn't heard about it, but I'm putting it on the family calendar right now (and looking for a sitter for the kids, actually, I think I'll forward the news on to other young families I know and see if we can't go in on babysitters together and hang out as a group). Hubby's taking a nap at the moment but I'm nearly positive he'll be psyched by the idea - he's a high school teacher (for Cleveland, Lakewood is the only district he'd leave Cleveland for but there hasn't been an opening/offer so far) and that sounds like a great way to kick off the school year for him

Extra shiny cherry on top for promoting the eco-minded 5k. I will do my best to help spread word about that too, tho I'm no runner!


Ahmie

[Justine Cooper]

For nearly the same price you can get a better burger from the WestEnd, Around the Corner, Coffee Pot, or others than you can from McDonalds.

Go one step further to The Place to be and/or Mahalls and they are less than McDonalds.
.

But will my 4yr old enjoy it as much as McDonalds? The problem is that McD's has the play area to keep him quiet and a toy accompanies the meal (yes, I would be quite happy to have less plastic junk coming home with us, but he's 4 and doesn't quite understand that yet).

Dianna's on 117th earned loyalty from us on our first visit there about a week ago by how well they treated our son. They immediately offered a coloring page (torn out of a real coloring book) and crayons and were exceptionally kind and understanding about food accomodations for our baby who is cutting 5 teeth at the moment (our waitress rushed out a plate of steamed broccoli for him). The only real complaint I have is that the burger from the kids menu was WAY too big, but as complaints go that's a rare one and next time we'll just share an adult plate with our 4yr old instead.

Bella Dubby is also extremely kid-friendly and we appreciate it (tho don't go there as often as we could - it's too far for us to walk and parking is an issue in the area).

We're making an effort to visit non-chain places more often, but also keep in mind that many chains are actually individually owned franchises (IHOP and Applebee's often are), and their overhead is likely even more odd than an individual restaurant that can swap things off the menu quite easily if they become cost prohibitive in the region.

As to the smokers, it's not really much of an improvement having them clustered around the entrance under an overhang - I'm asthmatic and walking through the smoke to enter the establishment can quickly be deemed not worth the trouble when I have to walk through a crowd of smokers to get there. One person's rights end when they start trampling on the rights of another. My and my children's right to breathe exceeds a smoker's right to smoke in a particular spot. That is the spirit of the law.

Thanks for pointing out Diana's. We had the same experience with our children there. Also the food is really good for the price. We don't eat out as much anymore but family friendly is nice.