The First Mayoral Debate

[Ryan Patrick Demro]

I received my invitation today and it reads:

First Mayoral Debate
Sts. Cyril & Methodius Church
Wednesday, September 5, 2007
7:00-8:30pm
12608 Madison Avenue

I would like to thank St. Cyril's for providing a much needed opportunity to discuss the issues facing Lakewood.

[Ed FitzGerald]

I spoke with the organizer from St. Cyril's this afternoon, and I immediately agreed to this debate.

I'm looking forward to it, and I congratulate Sts. Cyril and Methodius parish for taking a leadership role in our civic discourse.

[Bill Call]

Councilmen Demro and Fitzgerald are two well qualified candidates. The City is lucky to have men of this caliber running for office.

I look forward to a lively debate.

[Suzanne Metelko]

From the announcement page:

SS. Cyril and Methodius Catholic Church will be
sponsoring the first mayoral debate.

Who: Mayor George, Councilman Demro, and Councilman Fitzgerald

What: Mayoral debate to discuss issues pertinent to you
~ Questions will be collected from the audience! ~

Where: SS. Cyril and Methodius Catholic Church Hall
12608 Madison Avenue

When: Wednesday, September 5, 2007
7-8:30pm

[Grace O'Malley]

Is it appropriate for a Catholic church to be "sponsoring" a political event?

I'd like to know if this is really being done under the auspices of Fr Duke and/or St Cyril's parish.

According to the United States Conference of Catholic Bishops, the Church needs to tread very carefully when engaged in any activity that can be construed as political because of their tax exempt status.

Was this event cleared with the Cleveland Diocese?

According to the USCCB, there are clear guidelines on political activity. I refer you to this site for information:

http://www.usccb.org/ogc/guidelines.shtml#1


In particular, from the Public Forums section:

IRS has also indicated that an organization that invited two opposing candidates with the knowledge and expectation that one would not accept the invitation because of well-known opposing viewpoints would likely not be considered to have provided equal access.

I think it has been very public knowledge (and I can find lots of quotes online) that the Mayor does not plan to participate in a debate. This is hardly surprising as incumbents are advised by political strategists to eschew debates.

In "sponsoring" a debate where one knows full well in advance that all candidates will not participate, it is potentially a violation of the IRS guidelines on Church political activity if it can be construed as a bias toward the other two candidates.

I think there are many questions here that merit further investigation. I do hope that the parish is fully aware of their responsibilities in avoiding any conflict with these guidelines.

[/quote]

[Bryan Schwegler]

In particular, from the Public Forums section:

IRS has also indicated that an organization that invited two opposing candidates with the knowledge and expectation that one would not accept the invitation because of well-known opposing viewpoints would likely not be considered to have provided equal access.

I think it has been very public knowledge (and I can find lots of quotes online) that the Mayor does not plan to participate in a debate. This is hardly surprising as incumbents are advised by political strategists to eschew debates.

In "sponsoring" a debate where one knows full well in advance that all candidates will not participate, it is potentially a violation of the IRS guidelines on Church political activity if it can be construed as a bias toward the other two candidates.

I think there are many questions here that merit further investigation. I do hope that the parish is fully aware of their responsibilities in avoiding any conflict with these guidelines.

In this case there are 3 candidates, and at least 2 have publicly accepted, therefore the opposing sides piece is covered. It also appears from the announcement that George accepted also.

The more important question is whether the church itself sponsoring it or is the church just providing the space to another party that is sponsoring it? If it's the second, then none of the conflict rules apply.

Also in the eyes of the IRS, an open debate where all are invited wouldn't preclude a church from holding it even if all invited didn't attend. An incumbent who just chooses to not attend because they don't feel like defending their record wouldn't fall under the guidelines of "well-known opposing viewpoints".

Now if the incumbent favored abortion and the church was having a forum on why aborting is immoral and invited an anti-abortion activist and the mayor, that would be a different story.

A non-partisan debate does not count as a "viewpoint" to oppose. A debate is not a position in itself.

BTW, I've never seen a Presidential incumbent, a Congressional incumbent, or a state-wide office incumbent not attend any debates so I question your logic as if that's normal.

[Ed FitzGerald]

I've followed this pretty closely, for obvious reasons, and I've never heard that the mayor won't participate in debates. My understanding is that he will participate in the Chamber of Commerce's forum later in September, and will be at the League of Women Voters in October, assuming he makes it through the October 2nd primary.

If any community group wants to sponsor a forum or debate, all of the candidates are free to accept or decline, as they see fit- I see nothing biased about that.

My guess is that the mayor will participate in the debate at St. Cyril's because he is being forced to acknowledge that his re-election chances are tenuous. The format allowing questions from the audience is sure to make for a very interesting evening.

[Mike Deneen]

As a general rule, it's normal for incumbents to avoid debates as much as they can. Or, at the national level, they try to muddle or water down debates as much as possible (town hall meetings). Challengers usually want to debate, because they feel they need exposure. Of course, they "claim" that they are doing it for the common good.

We have a textbook example of this phenomenon right here in town.

As mentioned on this board about ten billion times last year, Congressional Candidate Kucinich does not debate.

Presidential Candidate Kucinich, on the other hand, loves debates, and wishes that they had another one every day.

Perhaps the two will get together for a debate on the relative merits of debates.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Ryan/Ed

I just got back from a night of walking the streets of Lakewood.

Once again quiet, nothing going on.

I missed most of this discussion.

So if there is only two of you, Ryan and Ed, will we still get a vigorous debate?

Will both of you promise right now, if elected, as the incumbent, you will accept all debates that come your way before the primary.

With no idea who the moderator is?

Will you accept the open offer from the Observer to our debates?

The Observer is also more than willing to offer a social night to meet candidates face to face with residents. A light and social evening?

You have all said, well maybe not Ed. That the Lakewood Observer is Lakewood's ONLY transparent website. Now that you have accepted the offer from the Church, of Father's Duke's Debate.

Will you accept ours?

I can't even believe the issue of fairness and objectivity by the LO is being discussed. The openness and fairness of the Observer Project is beyond reproach.

Jay Foran

From our members, the people (9%) of Lakewood?

I am just curious.

FWIW


.

[Lynn Farris]

I've attended debates at this church every election year or almost every year. I just thought this was a very active church. I'm not sure if the church was actually sponsoring it or they were renting their facilities to be used for this activity.

It was my understanding all 3 candidates were debating.

[Suzanne Metelko]

Ryan/Ed

Will both of you promise right now, if elected, as the incumbent, you will accept all debates that come your way before the primary.

With no idea who the moderator is?

Will you accept the open offer from the Observer to our debates?

Will you accept ours?
.

Ok Jim, when and where, I ask again. At least Father Duke gave us several weeks to move our schedules around however it is all moot now.

[Ed FitzGerald]

Jim-

I proposed about 5 months ago that there should be four debates prior to the primary, focusing on different issues such as crime, taxes and finances, housing, and economic development. At the time you told me it "wasn't in the budget" for the LO to sponsor them.

I haven't gotten an invitation from the Observer to participate in a pre-primary debate since then. If there's going to be one, let me know and I'll attend.

I don't expect any mayor to go to a debate every week. If a respected community institution sponsors one, he probably should. That's how I feel about the St. Cyril's debate, and thats what I would do if I were the mayor four years from now.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Suzanne/Ed/Tom

I agree with all of your comments. Except, I have had a budget for the debates since last year. There was a decision to not stage debates that conflicted with League of Woman Voters, the Chamber, Lakewood Alive, as it is best for the paper to support those efforts not work against them. I might have said , "not in the cards, but never said no budget."

We are not looking for a show, we are not counting on any theatrics.

As Suzanne pointed out to me once when speaking of the Observer debates. She would need to know well in advance, I assured it would be done. She told me she would need to know topics, and who the moderators are. This is not a problem.

Ed, when you stopped by the house, you said some impressive things that really caught my ear. We have had moments, but I think we will impress you with how unbiased and how fair this will be.

Email me contacts numbers for the planning side, and I will let you in.

Our registered letter will come out next week, phrased EXACTLY as the St. Cyril Letter was phrased, just to keep level.

Lakewood, we will not let you down, or cheapen our product.

(Weeks? I thought, Ryan, Ed and got the registered letters Tuesday morning at 8:05 am and Tom got his Monday afternoon? I could be wrong)

.

[Lynn Farris]

I assumed that Sts. Cyril & Methodius Church was the same as St. Gregory's Hall (their auditorium) that they rent out to many groups such as the Chamber of Commerce that hosts debates there every election cycle. I was contacted and I know understand the difference.

I do remember being in the actual church once for a debate many years ago I remember a petition which would have applied the same regulations as HB920 to cities that was being debated along with a mayoral/council/school board debate - but I have attended debates/forums at St. Gregories many times.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Ok Jim, when and where, I ask again. At least Father Duke gave us several weeks to move our schedules around however it is all moot now.

So this was planned and approved by Father Duke, correct?


Suzanne, please tell me when I have not be fair and open or supportive to anything a group headed by you has brought to me? Should I list?




.