Lakewood City Workers Are Seeking 12% Raise

[Bill Call]

I have heard from a usually reliable source that the unions representing City workers are seeking raises of 4% in 06, 4% in 07 and 4% in 08. They are also seeking enhanced medical benefits and increased paid days off.

These increase if enacted Citywide would cost about 5 million dollars a year in the last year of the contract. That would be for wages and the related payroll expenses but not hospitalization.

If you were Mayor what would you do?

If you are a member of council who wants to be Mayor what would you do?

[Stan Austin]

Bill-- If I were a mayor or a poster on this deck I'd first learn basic arithmetic.

Stop this crap of using fake numbers and stupid addition to inflame people.

Stan

[Phil Florian]

What should city or county or any other level of government pay their employees? Should it be competetive with the private sector? Should it ever be better? Worse? Is 4% excessive? I read that the national average is about 3.7% so is asking for (which doesn't mean getting it, does it?) 4% so unreasonable?

I guess I am wondering about the context of your questions. Are you asking because you think this is a rip off and we should cut pay for city workers? Or are you asking because you bask in the glow of love for them and think they deserve more than 4% a year? Just curious.

[Phil Florian]

Bill-- If I were a mayor or a poster on this deck I'd first learn basic arithmetic.

Stop this crap of using fake numbers and stupid addition to inflame people.

Stan

That is funny! I was thinking the same thing. One could easily have said, "City Workers Asking for 120% Raise!!!" and then note in smaller letters "...over the course of their 30 year career."

[Charyn Compeau]

..

[Bill Call]

Stop this crap of using fake numbers and stupid addition to inflame people.Stan

If you have better numbers and more intelligent addition please present them.

The costs of operating the City are increasing faster than new tax dollars are being generated. Since the City cannot operate at a deficit that means real cuts in spending or an income tax increase.

Over a three year period annual 4% raises increase payroll costs by 12.48%. I see nothing wrong with projecting those costs three years into the future. We can't keep planning month to month.

During the last negotiations the Mayor convinced City employees to accept one year without a wage increase. While that was commendable in a sense it delayed the inevitable.

So, I will ask again, if you were Mayor how would you deal with stagnant revenue and increased costs? It seems a reasonable question.

[Stan Austin]

Bill--- What you have done is posited a hypothetical. You could have just as easily said that the unions will request 10% a year increase or they would work for free. Either one would be equally unrelated to reality and mere speculation.
And, once again, you insist on taking a hypothetical number of 4% and arbitrarily multiplying it by 3 to come up with an alarming number. As Phil Florian pointed out, you could use that technique and multiply it by 20 and come up with an even bigger number.
But over and above everything else employer/employee bargaining in the public realm is now a very structured affair. Both parties are very aware of the capabilities of each other and consequently are careful to be responsible.
Failing agreement, there is mandatory arbitration which usually achieves a common sense agreement.
Which brings us back to square one----- what is your motive in pulling numbers out of thin air, using multipliers which distort, and implying greedy motives on the part of hard working city employees and venality on the part of the administration? You are not promoting public discourse but in reality using the techniques of separate and divide which we reject in Lakewood civic discourse.
Stan Austin

[Mark Reinhold]

My gut feeling IS that Lakewood is a good and well paid place to work.

Please see the following statistics from:

http://www.city-data.com/city/Ohio.html

Larger communities in Ohio ( middle sized cities)

Lakewood average salary: $51,348 total employees 553
Mentor average salary: $46,566 total employees 400
Middletown average salary: $45,910 total employees 518
Springfield average salary: $46,627 total employees 668
Youngstown average salary: $42,662 total employees 843
Canton average salary: $41,013 total employees 960
Cleveland Heights average salary: $48,280 total employees 494
(we pay well and employ a great number)

It is true that communities like Shaker Heights and Strongsville pay higher wages but their communities are nicer, more well kept and property values are rising. These communities are growing. ( I know this is subjective)...but (according to info on link:).

Strongsville housing starts in the last 5 years 800+/-
Shaker Heights housing starts in the last 5 years 60
Cleveland Hts. 86 starts in 5 years
Fairview 9 starts in 5 years
River 115 starts
Lakewood starts( I know this is wrong but it IS the figure on the website until 2005) 2 housing starts over the last five years.

Lakewood is finally building a great number, and selling some..... that is great., but does that mean more public investment and employee cost also?... back to employee costs.

I DO NOT think necessarily if we pay the employees better we will be better served. We should pay a commensurate wage and continue to watch our total numbers.

Commensurate wages in our immediate communities show that Lakewood already pays well.

Lakewood average: $51.348
Rocky River: $48,351
Cleveland: $44,279
Fairview Park: $50,252
Westlake: $44,379

Lakewood also has a "Living Wage" provision in the codified ordinances that might drive wages un-naturally up. It should be looked at also.

Avon Lake and Bay Village pay virtually the same wages but I would guess their small size increase their average. (Less lower paid workers)

Lakewood as a community decides to spent money on areas that care for the less fortunate rather than spend money on departments that raise money and care for the highest taxpayers. Look carefully at health and welfare employee costs in Lakewood and compare them to the same costs in growing communities.

Lakewood Health and Human Services 64 employees 11.6% of total empl.
Shaker Heights 10 employees
Strongsville 8 employees
Cleveland 260 employees 3.2% of total employees.

I would hope that Lakewood would employee the CORRECT amount of employees a number that provides the community accepted amount of care and not more than our citizens require. Other communities might provide less service to the less fortunate so that more turnover and more investment would occur. We should make these decisions together.

I do not know what the answer, I hope the stats provide fodder for conversation.

[ryan costa]

So....Lakewood is like France?

[Phil Florian]

Mark, thanks for the great stats!

An area near and dear to my heart is the secton about "Health and Human Services." Does the need of the community drive the employment or does the departmental choices (hiring a ton vs. little) drive the services? I would argue that our HHS needs in Lakewood are a bit more diverse (not racially, but in terms of needs) and more a day to day issue in Lakewood than some of those cities cited, with the exception of Cleveland or Youngstown. The diversity of the housing stock, the relatively lower prices and higher percentage of rental units and its accessible environment make it a prime choice for a wide variety of people and needs.

I would also want to know how much the County HHS services Lakewood in comparison to, in particular, Cleveland and Youngstown. I would expect a large amount of County services (and their contract agencies) would be holding a lot of the HHS needs in the larger urban areas vs. a suburban environment, even a suburb that tends to stress the urban part of the name.

Is Lakewood making up the difference with its own employees? I personally like that needs are met in-community by people who work in the community vs. at some office on the other side of town. But that is just me.

For clarification, what are the "departments that care the for the highest taxpayers?"

Also, and I don't know if this effects the numbers, does the total employee count all services provided by the city, even the ones that may be contracted out? How would looking at that effect the decision to give raises vs. status quo vs. maybe replacing with contract worker?

Mark, thanks again for some solid numbers to chew on. They don't give answers to anything but certainly point in a direction to consider.

Phil

[dl meckes]

One question I have is whether other cities have (and run) senior housing and what their senior populations are.

I would guess the answer to that question might shed some light on the number of HHS employees, but it is only a guess.

[Bill Call]

His not to distant post about overtime proves that. The MAJORITY of the time a city, or any other union shop for that matter, is far, far better off incurring overtime, even in significant amounts, as opposed to increasing staffing levels. Charyn

Overtime is a very sensible way to meet a temporary or cyclical increase in demand for a product or service.

In the case of the City most overtime is needed to cover unscheduled absences, aka sick time. When some City departments have up to 10% of their work force calling in sick the payment of overtime is not the result of an increase in demand.

In an effort to control those costs the City is charging more employees with abuse of sick time. I haven't been able to find out what affect those efforts are having. I do know that City employees view sick time as extra vacation time.

What percentage of the work force at your place of employment calls in sick each day?

In any case, this post isn't about the single issue of sick time. The City has virtually no borrowing authority and no cash reserves. While there has been a small increase in income tax collections and property tax collections revenue in the near future will be stagnant.

How will we continue to fund the needs of the City? Would you feel better if we pretended there wasn't a problem?

[DougHuntingdon]

You could almost rent a ten bedroom apt in Youngstown for $500 a month.

[Grace O'Malley]

It is true that communities like Shaker Heights and Strongsville pay higher wages but their communities are nicer, more well kept and property values are rising. These communities are growing. ( I know this is subjective)...but (according to info on link:).

I'd like to point out that, according to the last property reappraisal done by the county, Lakewood property values rose an average of 15%, a rate higher than Rocky River and Westlake. So your statement is incorrect.

In addition, your comment that Strongsville is a "nicer," or better kept community is a totally subjective observation. For example, I consider Strongsville a rural community that had a mall plopped in the middle surrounded by scattered developments of identical boxes called houses. Personally, and this is subjective, I wouldn't choose to live in Strongsville even if I was offered a free home.

So lets not make those kind of comparisons between Lakewood and other cities. Numbers and facts, with all the attendant supporting info, is much more helpful.

[Mark Reinhold]

Grace,

Thanks for your thoughts, share with me your source on the 15% increase in property values... I argued mine and went from a 4.6% proposed increase down to a 2.4% increase. This was based on recorded house sales in my neighborhood selling for 2.2% less than appraised value.

Like I said I found no evidence on the web about comparing housing values, so please post your source. The county does not even use the figures until 2007.

I did find the following on house.com... (not the best source.)

Rocky River median house price $187,000
Lakewood median house price $117,900

% of River Houses worth below 100,000 4.2%
% of Lakewood houses worth below 100,000 29.8%

% of River Houses worth below 150,000 28.0%
% of Lakewood houses worth below 100,000 77.0%

% of River Houses worth above 300,000 13.2%
% of lakewood houses worth below 100,000 4.8%

Lakewood is a bargain community. A 20,000 raise in property value would have a 17% increase in value for the single median valued home in Lakewood and a 10.6% increase in value for the River one.

As far a "NICE" goes it is truly subjective... remember I live here.

Check out the following figures that might have an effect on some... they didn't on me when purchasing a home.

2004 figures from http://www.city-data.com/city/Ohio.html

0 MURDERS in the city of Strongsville (2004)
1 MURDER in the city of Lakewood (2004)

0 RAPES in the city of Strongsville (2004)
7 RAPES in the city of Lakewood (2004)

0 ROBBERIES in the city of Strongsville (2004)
40 ROBBERIES in the city of Lakewood (2004)

0 ASSAULTS in the city of Strongsville (2004)
77 ASSAULTS in the city of Lakewood (2004)

29 BURGLARIES in the city of Strongsville (2004)
291 BURGLARIES in the city of Lakewood (2004)

328 THEFTS in the city of Strongsville (2004)
779 THEFTS in the city of Lakewood (2004)

23 AUTO THEFTS in the city of Strongsville (2004)
104 AUTO THEFTS in the city of Lakewood (2004)

The original string was about WAGES. not my ability to search the web for figures. All I want is for Lakewood to be taxed and staffed at appropriate rates. Nice is subjective .... I said that in my original post. I was only saying that Lakewood employees are paid well for staffing our OK city.

I cannot get figures backing up OK.... I was just trying to ruffle some feathers.