DO NOT SIGN

[Jim O'Bryan]

There is a group of people working the streets of Lakewood with petitions. I have encountered 6 of them. They all say it is to raise state money for schools and education. they will tell you it will not cost you the taxpayer anymore in taxes.

What they will not tell you is that it is for gambling on the ballot.

Deceptive, and part of their plan.



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[Danielle Masters]

Jim, thanks for the heads up.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Jim, thanks for the heads up.

They are pretty slick.


Kids(under 30) wsith a great patter about how this will make schools better, for no cost out of our pockets.


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[David Scott]

Actually, I believe in letting the voters decide. I believe in signing any petition for a ballot that is non-discriminatory (not the defense of marriage act), and then letting it be decided by the voters. This is the best way for a true democracy to work.

[Jim O'Bryan]

Actually, I believe in letting the voters decide. I believe in signing any petition for a ballot that is non-discriminatory (not the defense of marriage act), and then letting it be decided by the voters. This is the best way for a true democracy to work.

Maybe so, but isn't actually getting it to a vote also part of the process? Isn't signing a petition, like a primary election? While I admire your zest for democracy, I wonder how it works. Let something you are dead set against to the vote, then work your ass of to defeat it later?

So you think it is OK for them to lie as mislead. You would not care if I could put a petition for the defense of marriage act in front of you to sign, and tell you that it was feeding children?

I should ignore that it has been beaten down by the populace many times but should turn a blind eye to what could be an attack on schools, and any levies they might be seeking, like one in Lakewood?

So I vote no on the Lakewood School Levy because I know that this other one is there to help the schools.

Call me old fashion, I like it when truth and politics meet.

FWIW



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[Mark Timieski]

Is this the petition?

http://www.ag.state.oh.us/legal/ballot/gambling_quinn3.pdf
http://feeds.cincinnatinews.net/?rid=712149d8ad6bdbe0&cat=90d24f4ad98a2793&f=1

I’m not a lawyer, but maybe there are a few in the audience. Would the “single subject ruleâ€Â￾ be applicable to this petition?

Are there any penalties for presenting a petition under false pretense?

Is there any recourse that a citizen has after being duped into signing this thing? It looks like there are some provisions in Ohio law (maybe §3501.38 ) that allows someone to have their name removed?

[Jim O'Bryan]

Is this the petition?

http://www.ag.state.oh.us/legal/ballot/gambling_quinn3.pdf
http://feeds.cincinnatinews.net/?rid=712149d8ad6bdbe0&cat=90d24f4ad98a2793&f=1

I’m not a lawyer, but maybe there are a few in the audience. Would the “single subject ruleâ€Â￾ be applicable to this petition?

Are there any penalties for presenting a petition under false pretense?

Is there any recourse that a citizen has after being duped into signing this thing? It looks like there are some provisions in Ohio law (maybe §3501.38 ) that allows someone to have their name removed?

You bet




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[Charyn Varkonyi]

Gambling - as in Casinos, Riverboats, etc?

While I dont appreciate someone deceiving me into signing some thing (I am the PITA that will sit on the street and make them wait while I read the whole thing) - I do think that gaming industry licensing is a valid issue that should be brought before the voters.

I need to go read this - perhaps a discussion of the issue it self should be a new thread....

Peace,
~charyn

[David Scott]

Rather then direct your frustration at the petition language, which has been approved by the State Elections Board, perhaps you should review the new rules put into effect by our Secretary of State. Now the person collecting the signatures must file the petition with the State. Previously the signature gatherer would forward the petitions to a supervisor who would then mail them in. No more, these petitions are now invalid. Many of the larger signature gathering organizations have pulled out of Ohio.

So yes, the petitions with poor wording on the streets of Lakewood are a major problem because they might confuse people. Got news for you, most people never read the petitions and the ballot language is so confusing that most people rely on the League of Women Voters to summarize the issue.

So I'll look out for this poorly worded issue and not let it come to the ballot even though it might promote economic development and then turn my head when the Secretary of State continues to erode my democratic rights.

[Mark Timieski]

The issue is not with the petition language, the issue is with the petition circulators. Potential voters are being asked to sign a petition in support of a scholarship program, the actual petition is for the legalization of slot machines.

[Jim O'Bryan]

David

First I second what Mark said. These people are lying about the whole thing. The entire sign-up is a scam. Should people read the wording, yes, but many are trusting souls. But what the hey, I can let these people get lied to and used. Cool way to start it off. Let's debate the issue.

Economic Development! Casinos are not economic development, especially for where I live. The results are in. Wherever Casinos go, divorce up, crime up, domestic violence up, hard drug use up, poverty up. Most casino money lives the city the casino is in. Buffalo, Atlantic City, Niagra Falls, City after city falls into the trap.

What would make you think casinos make sense? Or even funnier good economic development?

[Mike Deneen]

My, my, my.

Suddenly our lefty leader Jim sounds a an awful lot like those kooks on the Religious Right. Gambling is the root of all evil.....unless, of course, it's bingo night in the church basement.

Apparently on this issue he was traded over to the dark side in exchange for Bill Bennett.

Seriously, though, the sad fact is that Ohio waited about 35 years too long for casinos to be a truely effective economic tool. Atlantic City was the first non-Nevada place to become a gambling destination, and now virtually every state in the area is in on the act. All we would be doing now is stopping our local gamblers from leaving the state, not bringing new tourists in.

I'm not necessarily saying it's a bad idea. I'm sure there is some value in keeping our gamblers home. However, any promises of major economic spinoff are dubious given the large number of casinos within a modest drive (Mountaineer, Detroit, Windsor, Niagara).

[Jim O'Bryan]

Mike

Instead of branding me the right wing kook, go to Buffalo. Ask the residents how it has helped them. They are the poster child for how wrong things can go, with the promise of new found wealth.

But someone like you should be able to pull a little common sense out on this one.

Had Ohio talked about this in the 50s, I would say yes give it a shot, the 60s, 70s, 80s give it a shot from the 90s on for Cleveland, it became a dead issue. If we pass this law right now today, one arm bandits come in within 2-5 years casinos. So that you hit the nail on the head, all it will do is keep a few gamblers at home, while turning others into gamblers here at home. We could easily have the nicest casino between Erie and Lorain! Now that is a money maker, which is worth turning neighbors into hookers, crackheads, and out on the street for. Though not as financially rewarding, leaches would be kinder.

But it is the over riding FACTS of what Casinos do to the area around them I cannot turn my back on, and you of all people know how puritain I am.

In the effort of full disclosure, I have been to Vegas and gambled, though I found the desert nicer and more satisfying. I buy a couple lottery tickets each week. I love playing backgammon for money, have never played a game where money wasn't involved. I have never "preached" anti gambling. But in 2006 with the Fed tightening money, bankruptcy not freeing most from their debts, and the studies that have been done on gambling and cities I have to think this is just a terrible idea.

But let's let petition signers get lied to and get it to a vote, then let the casino lobby publish commercial after commercial on gambling makes us feel happy. We could all be big time poker players. Then we can suck the last few remaining pennies from the poor souls with no control.

If you really feel this way, the Dog Park is non-profit, you could have your own little dog park casino by state law. Actually you could have up to 5 dog park casinos. Then you could trade human misery for happy dogs.


FWIW

[Jim O'Bryan]

An earlier post from Ken Warren last year on casinos...

Because Lakewood is within ten miles of the casino, the results for this city would be detrimental.

Writing for the UB Reporter, Kathleen Weaver, reports: “Individuals who live within 10 miles of a casino or in a disadvantaged neighborhood are more likely to experience problem gambling, according to new research from UB's Research Institute on Addictions (RIA).

A casino within 10 miles of home has a significant effect on problem gambling and is associated with a 90 percent increase in the odds of being a pathological or problem gambler, said John W. Welte, principal investigator on the study.

The likely reason for the increase, he added, is that the availability of an attractive gambling opportunity can lead to gambling pathology in some people who otherwise would not develop it.

The study, involving a national telephone survey of 2,631 U.S. adults, was reported in a recent issue of Journal of Gambling Studies. While geographic location nearly doubled the risk, Welte stressed the importance of placing the study results in perspective.

"Individual traits have a stronger relationship to gambling pathology than geographic factors," he added. "For example, in another analysis of this survey that previously was reported, we found that problem drinkers had 23 times the odds of having a gambling problem than individuals who did not have a drinking problem."

According to Welte, "Gambling behavior and problem-gambling behaviors are multi-faceted. Social and environmental influences on gambling behavior and pathology are interesting in themselves. They have a special relevance to public policy debates. Because localities can control the location and density of gambling opportunities, such as casinos or lottery outlets, policy makers have some influence over the rates of problem gambling in our society."

Welte said respondents living in disadvantaged neighborhoods reported much higher rates of problem gambling than those who do not live in disadvantaged neighborhoods. Ten percent of those who live in the most disadvantaged neighborhoods are problem gamblers as compared to about 1 percent of those who live in the least disadvantaged neighborhoods.

"We know that this is not simply an effect of poverty at the individual level," explained Welte, a senior scientist at RIA and a research associate professor in the Department of Social and Preventive Medicine, School of Public Health and Health Professions. "Acceptance of gambling by family and friends, unrealistic expectations from gambling combined with a financial desperation, might be the explanation."

Welte added that it also must be acknowledged that some of the problem gamblers interviewed in the study might have been forced to move to disadvantaged neighborhoods by financial setbacks.

Past-year gambling was more common in states with two or more forms of legal gambling, and the average number of times gambled per year also was higher in those states with more forms of legal gambling. In fact, the odds of gambling for study respondents during the past year increased by 17 percent for every additional form of legal gambling in their state.

For the purposes of this study, levels of gambling behavior were labeled as "any gambling in the past year," "frequent gambling" (defined as gambling 104 or more times in the past year) and "problem gambling" (manifesting problem gambling symptoms, such as preoccupation with gambling and needing to gamble with increasing amounts of money to get the same excitement)."

For more see: http://www.buffalo.edu/reporter/vol36/v ... ml?print=1

Kenneth Warren

From the discussion are Casinos good for Cleveland.

[Mike Deneen]

Don't be silly.

Dogs don't like casinos.....they much prefer playing poker!

http://gaming.unlv.edu/gallery/a_friend_in_need.htm