The Observation Deck

On Morning Joe

When asked to explain the fear of health care reform Peggy Noonan, who I do think
is much saner than many of the people she wrote speeches for said. "Well the way
I explain the problems with health care reform is that these are the people that brought
you the DMZ, the Post Office, and the War in Iraq."

Huh?


.

it would have been better to switch out DMZ, post office and war in Iraq for : Medicare, Medicaid and the VA Hospital system. Then I think she would have had a point.

However, if you want a valid reason for why we shouldn't want the governments proposed healthcare program, just ask congress, after all, they won't be using it, so why should we have to?

If Congress had to use the same system that our vetrans do, there probably wouldn't be a problem.

And if Ted Kennedy had to use the very system he's proposing, he'd probably be dead right now.

Bret Callentine wrote:it would have been better to switch out DMZ, post office and war in Iraq for : Medicare, Medicaid and the VA Hospital system. Then I think she would have had a point.

Brett

Thank you.

I am working with Vets on a couple things, and one story that has come to light is a Vet
with a hearing aid that HAS TO go to the VA Hospital for batteries. They will not mail them,
but then take his mileage to reimburse him for the expense of getting there, about $10.00.

That said, as we have learned in Sicko, nearly every other country in the world has been
able to work through national health care to great benefits of all. The residents, the
doctors, the hospitals, everyone.

We can work this out, and then we can move on.

.

as we have learned in Sicko,

Please don't muddy the waters of a difficult issue with Michael Moore references.

Bret Callentine wrote:

as we have learned in Sicko,

Please don't muddy the waters of a difficult issue with Michael Moore references.

Bret, did you watch Bill Moyers? It looks like Sicko may not be that far off.

http://www.pbs.org/moyers/journal/blog/ ... n_for.html

the good news is...

I did a study of professional baseball teams in the majors. Using criteria like: Does the team play in a tax payer funded stadium, How little is the average ticket price, How readily available are tickets, and how economical is the teams overall payroll...

according to my findings the Cleveland Indians are one of the greatest baseball teams on earth.

YEAH TEAM!!!

The government is in charge of Medicaid and medicaid works well. Medicaid should be used as a model.

Jim O'Bryan wrote:That said, as we have learned in Sicko, nearly every other country in the world has been
able to work through national health care to great benefits of all. The residents, the
doctors, the hospitals, everyone.

Great benefits to everyone except malpractice lawyers and insurance companies.

How many "extra" procedures/tests are done only to cover someone’s behind in case of a lawsuit?

How much of the doctor/hospital bill goes for malpractice insurance?

I bet lawyers are drowning in their own drool at the prospect of this passing. A potential of 50 million more people to file a lawsuit on their behalf.

You can't (shouldn't) have health care reform without doing something to reduce frivolous lawsuits.

it is pretty hard to make laws to prevent frivolous lawsuits. and to prevent the success of frivolous lawsuits. It almost seems like doing this yields the opposite results.

blame the judges and the juries.

When juries start ignoring minute legal detail and voting against frivolous plaintiffs and frivolous prosecutors, there will be fewer frivolous lawsuits.

The whole "jury of peers" thing is a tool to keep law from getting too complex, and to prevent lawyers from becoming what the roman catholic clergy were to medieval feudal Europe. The "Separation of Church and state" part of the Constitution was reaction to the fact that the church was a very thick portion of the "State" in most European countries. Today lawyers are government to anyone who isn't a lawyer. the instruments of justice are nigh-incomprehensible to most non-lawyers.

Stop graduating students from law schools for 5 years.

ryan costa wrote:it is pretty hard to make laws to prevent frivolous lawsuits.

Especially when such a high percentage of the government is, itself, lawyers. They will not support or vote for a rod against themselves should they return to the private sector.

I agree with Mr. Page. Tort reform would go a long way to helping reduce the costs involved in the health care system.

Jim O'Bryan wrote:That said, as we have learned in Sicko, nearly every other country in the world has been able to work through national health care to great benefits of all. The residents, the doctors, the hospitals, everyone.

I believe the Canadians who had to come across the border for diagnosis and treatment would beg to differ and I believe those that died waiting in line would try, if they could.

Tell you what. I'll feel better about universal health care when the Congress itself accepts to use it. Think they'll do it? There's at least one bill in the House proposing they use it too. Let's see if it even get brought up for a discussion.

Hi,
Mr. Prichard, you said, "I believe the Canadians who had to come across the border for diagnosis and treatment would beg to differ and I believe those that died waiting in line would try, if they could." I would like to clarify a point for you. This is from http://www.denverpost.com/recommended/ci_12523427

"Myth: Canadians are paying out of pocket to come to the U.S. for medical care.Most patients who come from Canada to the U.S. for health care are those whose costs are covered by the Canadian governments. If a Canadian goes outside of the country to get services that are deemed medically necessary, not experimental, and are not available at home for whatever reason (e.g., shortage or absence of high tech medical equipment; a longer wait for service than is medically prudent; or lack of physician expertise), the provincial government where you live fully funds your care. Those patients who do come to the U.S. for care and pay out of pocket are those who perceive their care to be more urgent than it likely is. "

I'm shocked to see someone argue that our system is better that Canada's. I take it you have health insurance, sir and if you do you are lucky. But you understand, I hope, that many Americans do not have insurance and if they get ill they do not get proper treatment. In some cases it is not because they can't afford it but because they have a preexisting condition. How can you argue against all Americans being covered for a basic necessity of life?

Congress does have great Health Care at the public's expense. How dare Voinvich (and others that vote similarly) vote against providing health care for all when we have provided it for him for so long.

How many Canadians have got bankrupt due to cost of health care needed to stay alive? NONE. Whether or not someone gets care needed to live, should not be made by people that are profiting from not providing it. Eliminate the insurance companies 30plus% profits and the cost of our health care is drastically reduced without touching the quality of care.

Tort reform usually just yields more legalese. it pushes the services of lawyers into a higher premium of payments, and the instruments of justice into a more distant sphere of exclusivity.

Here is all the tort reform we need: "Be careful, stupid". Notify the high school civics classes.

the Jury clause in the Constitution is the ultimate Check and Balance. it is a tool to prevent the lawyer offspring of plantation owners and patricians from gaining too much power over decent Yeomen Farmers and Mechanics! It is the responsibility of civilian juries to prevent the law, judges, and Prosecutors from becoming too dickish.

As for Medicine, you will always find Canadians coming to the U.S. for some treatment or other. and there are Americans going to Canada for prescription pills. and there are Americans going to clinics in Mexico, the Caribbean, and China and Taiwan for surgery and FDA-unapproved cancer treatments.

ryan costa wrote:blame the judges and the juries.

When juries start ignoring minute legal detail and voting against frivolous plaintiffs and frivolous prosecutors, there will be fewer frivolous lawsuits.

When insurance companies settle because it costs less than to fight, you only invite more frivolous lawsuits and then it snowballs until you wind up where we are today.

I heard of a local OB who was sued by someone whose daughter didn’t get into the college she wanted and the parents have been led to believe it’s because of something that happened during the birth...18 years ago! How f’d up is that?

I would bet there's not a doctor around who doesn't have a story about some whacked out lawsuit.

Donald Farris wrote:Hi,
Mr. Prichard, you said, "I believe the Canadians who had to come across the border for diagnosis and treatment would beg to differ and I believe those that died waiting in line would try, if they could." I would like to clarify a point for you. This is from http://www.denverpost.com/recommended/ci_12523427

Its Pitchford.

I'm sure for every article you find in favor, I can find one against. Here's mine:
From the New York Times (summary, dogs can get surgeries and MRIs faster than people can in Canada.)



Let's prevent an article quoting war before it begins. It doesn't pay to waste the time.

Donald Farris wrote:I'm shocked to see someone argue that our system is better that Canada's. I take it you have health insurance, sir and if you do you are lucky. But you understand, I hope, that many Americans do not have insurance and if they get ill they do not get proper treatment. In some cases it is not because they can't afford it but because they have a preexisting condition. How can you argue against all Americans being covered for a basic necessity of life?

1. I have health insurance provided through my job currently. However, when I was part-time, I paid $58.44 per month for a Medical Mutual policy, completely independent of my employer. To be completely blunt, If I lost my insurance tomorrow, I believe I would survive.

2. In my opinion, health insurance is NOT, as you put it, a basic necessity. Healthcare, however, is a completey different story, and right now, it is provided in any emergency room in the country, even to the uninsured. The illegals seem to be fine with it.
If basic necessities are so important, why has Congress not passed a "universal food" bill? Why am I going to the store every week to get milk and Hot Pockets?

I'm willing to play devil's advocate though. Let's say that Canada's system is better than ours.
Answer this for me: What makes you think that the United States government, which gives us such models of efficiency as the BMV, Amtrak and the $300 toilet seat can make things better for a cheaper price?

Donald Farris wrote:Congress does have great Health Care at the public's expense. How dare Voinvich (and others that vote similarly) vote against providing health care for all when we have provided it for him for so long.

I agree, but I view it from a different perspective. Their provided health care should be removed. Let them pay for their own policies.

Donald Farris wrote:Whether or not someone gets care needed to live, should not be made by people that are profiting from not providing it. Eliminate the insurance companies 30plus% profits and the cost of our health care is drastically reduced without touching the quality of care.

If I may ask a question: You sound as though you would have been in favor of windfall profit taxes on oil companies. Am I right?

What is the incentive to succeed if the government is going to take everything away?

You cannot help the poor by destroying the rich.
You cannot strengthen the weak by weakening the strong.
You cannot bring about prosperity by discouraging thrift.
You cannot lift the wage earner up by pulling the wage payer down.
You cannot further the brotherhood of man by inciting class hatred.
You cannot build character and courage by taking away men's initiative and independence.
You cannot help men permanently by doing for them what they could and should do for themselves.

--Abe Lincoln--
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I apologize for going so long, but I've sick of keeping silent. The hottest place in Hell is reserved for those who remain neutral in times of great moral conflict.
--Martin Luther King Jr.--

This universal health care stuff is more than just about health care, its about the freedoms established for us over 200 years ago.
Government health care is simply the stripping away of one more freedom.