debates

ryan costa · Post by **ryan costa** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 11:21 am

I only watched the first 53 minutes of the debate.

McCain calls Obama Most Liberal Guy in congress. that is hard to believe. I'm not sure what the qualifications are.

McCain calls for stricter contracts to rein in military spending. not invading Iraq would have reined in some military spending. You may have noticed Iraq and Afghanistan didn't haven much in the way of air forces or navies when we invaded.

McCain cites corporate income tax rate of Ireland as being lower than America. This is a common Republican talking point. Obama does not respond with higher progressive income taxes in Ireland, much greater access to healthcare and higher education for qualified students in Ireland, all the other higher taxes in Ireland, or any figures about wealth disparity and CEO to worker income disparity in Ireland compared to USA. McCain scores an easy talking point that is generally meaningless yet still influences people.

McCain is adamant about not talking to leaders of other countries unless they agree to conditions first. I'm not sure what the point is of having a President if that President is incapable of communicating directly with the leaders of other countries. We have telephones and email and live satellite communications these days. The president sure as heck won't be the one doing the fighting when he launches some hobby war against the next pissant developing country.

I can't distinguish between tactics and strategy either. I know they are spelled differently and generally correspond to different sections of the powerpoint presentation. apparently invading Iraq was part of a winning "strategy", but the ensuing chaos and violence are part of other peoples "tactical" errors.

both candidates said some stuff about "energy independence". I didn't hear either candidate promote conservation as a necessary step toward doing this. I'm not talking about mandating using less fuel. I'm talking about promoting using less fuel. using fewer miles and trips. This seems to be beyond them or some form of political suicide. it wouldn't be hard: they wouldn't even need to hire consultants: there's plenty of carpooling, mass transit, and frugality posters, newsreel spots, and radio scripts from World War II they can re-use. Americans love world war II: its when everyone had a job and America saved the world.

David Lay · Post by **David Lay** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 11:27 am

Looks like Ol' Mac couldn't control his temper: http://tinyurl.com/4bhknu

Jim DeVito · Post by **Jim DeVito** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:02 pm

McCain is adamant about not talking to leaders of other countries unless they agree to conditions first. I'm not sure what the point is of having a President if that President is incapable of communicating directly with the leaders of other countries. We have telephones and email and live satellite communications these days. The president sure as heck won't be the one doing the fighting when he launches some hobby war against the next pissant developing country.

Thanks is what I find just unbelievable. It blows my mind that we will not talk to anybody. Just because you sit down to talk out you differences with people does in no way legitimize the radical stance of the person. How are we ever going to solve anything if we do not talk to anybody!!!

Jim DeVito · Post by **Jim DeVito** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 12:16 pm

You know what else gets me. McCain runs these adds saying how Obama is all about big government and crazy tax hikes. Last time I checked McCain was on board with the bailout. Is that not the definition of big government?
How do you plan to increase the national debt by almost a trillion dollars and not have to raise taxes?

sharon kinsella · Post by **sharon kinsella** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 3:55 pm

He said horsesh**t during a presidential debate - HA!

How's that for anger management. Of course you can only do so much jaw-clenching in a couple of hours.

Danielle Masters · Post by **Danielle Masters** » Sat Sep 27, 2008 4:00 pm

The fact that he said that during the debate was not surprising. He does seem a bit tightly wound, no wonder he doesn't want to meet with many world leaders he probably knows he would totally lose it. The other thing last night that bugged me was that McCain seemed to not be showing Obama any respect while he was speaking. He didn't look his way and he was making all sorts of faces, his mannerisms just were nit very presidential.

ryan costa · Post by **ryan costa** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:55 am

from what sources I could find, the progressive income tax rate in Ireland was between 41 percent and 58 percent for the last 20 years. As of 2007, 41 percent of income over â‚¬ 35,400 was owed as income tax in Ireland. the years before that, when progressive income taxes were higher, economic growth in Ireland was higher. while there is an economic benefit to lowering progressive income taxes from over 60 percent to between 40 and 50 percent, the effect wears off after this and is ultimately offset by greater government debt.

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 5:54 pm

Family Told Obama NOT To Wear Soldier Son's Bracelet

http://newsbusters.org/blogs/warner-tod ... here-media

Shockingly, however, Madison resident Brian Jopek, the father of Ryan Jopek, the young soldier who tragically lost his life to a roadside bomb in 2006, recently said on a Wisconsin Public Radio show that his family had asked Barack Obama to stop wearing the bracelet with his son's name on it. Yet Obama continues to do so despite the wishes of the family.

Radio host Glenn Moberg of the show "Route 51" asked Mr. Jopek, a man who believes in the efforts in Iraq and is not in favor of Obama's positions on the war, what he and his ex-wife think of Obama continually using their son's name on the campaign trail. (h/t D. Keith Howington of www.dehavelle.com)

Jopek began by saying that his ex-wife was taken aback, even upset, that Obama has made the death of her son a campaign issue. Jopek says his wife gave Obama the bracelet because "she just wanted Mr. Obama to know Ryan's name." Jopek went on to say that "she wasn't looking to turn it into a big media event" and "just wanted it to be something between Barack Obama and herself." Apparently, they were all shocked it became such a big deal.

But, he also said that his ex-wife has refused further interviews on the matter and that she wanted Obama to stop wearing the reminder of her son's sacrifice that he keeps turning into a campaign soundbyte. This begins at about 10 minutes into the radio program.

Brian Pedaci · Post by **Brian Pedaci** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 6:18 pm

Stephen, it seems that's the father's view. The mother who gave Obama the bracelet was 'ecstatic' that he mentioned it in the debate:

MILWAUKEE -- The mother of a Wisconsin soldier who died in Iraq says she was "ecstatic" during Friday's debate when Sen. Barack Obama mentioned the bracelet she gave him in honor of her son.

Tracy Jopek, of Merrill, told the Associated Press on Sunday she was honored that he remembered Sgt. Ryan David Jopek, who was killed in 2006 by a roadside bomb.

She criticized Internet reports that suggested Obama exploited her son for political purposes. She acknowledges e-mailing the campaign in February asking that Obama not mention her son in speeches or debates.

But she said Obama's mention on Friday was appropriate because he was responding after Sen. John McCain said a soldier's mother gave him a bracelet.

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:28 pm

Brian Pedaci wrote:Stephen, it seems that's the father's view. The mother who gave Obama the bracelet was 'ecstatic' that he mentioned it in the debate:
MILWAUKEE -- The mother of a Wisconsin soldier who died in Iraq says she was "ecstatic" during Friday's debate when Sen. Barack Obama mentioned the bracelet she gave him in honor of her son.

Tracy Jopek, of Merrill, told the Associated Press on Sunday she was honored that he remembered Sgt. Ryan David Jopek, who was killed in 2006 by a roadside bomb.

She criticized Internet reports that suggested Obama exploited her son for political purposes. She acknowledges e-mailing the campaign in February asking that Obama not mention her son in speeches or debates.

But she said Obama's mention on Friday was appropriate because he was responding after Sen. John McCain said a soldier's mother gave him a bracelet.

mention??? he did not even know the soldiers name... he had to look at a piece of paper to remember his name...

Jim DeVito · Post by **Jim DeVito** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:42 pm

mention??? he did not even know the soldiers name... he had to look at a piece of paper to remember his name...

Great point... he must be a terrorist. :roll:

Grasping at straws my friend...

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:47 pm

Jim DeVito wrote:
mention??? he did not even know the soldiers name... he had to look at a piece of paper to remember his name...

Great point... he must be a terrorist.

Grasping at straws my friend...

Did you actually watch the debate? He had to look down to find the soldiers name...

Jim DeVito · Post by **Jim DeVito** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:51 pm

So what does that mean. That he has a thousand things on his mind.

Jim DeVito · Post by **Jim DeVito** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:52 pm

McCain could barley look up at the camera for most of the debate.

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Sun Sep 28, 2008 8:57 pm

Jim DeVito wrote:So what does that mean. That he has a thousand things on his mind.

he came across as insincere... hey look at me... I have a bracelet too...