The Observation Deck

Jim,

From what I can see, RR's rejection was the result of their long range plan. The boxes were huge, the language on them was DANGER HIGH VOLTAGE.

When the Mayor and Council looked at the long range plan, they conceded that a very important piece of the plan was contributed by open community hearings and focused on the aestetics of RR. The boxes wouldn't have fit in. The community wouldn't like them. And then the Mayor and Council took the time to ask the community's opinion, just to verify their assumption.

Fascinating. An 18 month process to develop a long range plan that Council and the Mayor opened to community wide participation. And now they're using it to make decisions and craft strategies that will effect the quality of life in Rocky River.

http://www.cacities.org/index.jsp?zone= ... tory=25207

http://www.geneva.il.us/att/Lightspeed.htm

http://www.freepress.net/news/16697

http://wistechnology.com/article.php?id=2899

I'm curious as to how many boxes there will be and where they will be located.

Wow. Thanks Suzanne.

One monster box for every 362 residences? That's a lot of boxes in a tiny area.

Either way, though, I think your prevous post says it all. Bring the community in to the discussion BEFORE the decision is made, not after. So maybe it takes a little longer to reach a conclusion. It's not like AT&T needs an answer TODAY.

RR did it. Lakewood schools did it. This way, you give EVERYBODY a voice, not just the chronic naysayers, who are always easy to arouse.

Joan Roberts wrote:Wow. Thanks Suzanne.

One monster box for every 362 residences? That's a lot of boxes in a tiny area.

Either way, though, I think your prevous post says it all. Bring the community in to the discussion BEFORE the decision is made, not after. So maybe it takes a little longer to reach a conclusion. It's not like AT&T needs an answer TODAY.

RR did it. Lakewood schools did it. This way, you give EVERYBODY a voice, not just the chronic naysayers, who are always easy to arouse.

Joan

There are many little secret groups running around this town. Old style Lakewood politics, many secret little "parties" and lunches then at the last second spring it on the public, and try to "grease the skids." To be honest It makes me a little sick. The one thing that should have come out of the number thing was the sooner you get the public involved the sooner you can learn what everyone wants, and tailor the project for those needs. This game cost us a nice little development at the end of Detroit.

As for winning or losing with AT&T, I think the general thought of Lakewoodites is we lost, possibly big. When you go back and look at the reasons given for voting for it by council members none are true, and all were proven to be not true early in the discussion.

"We need this new cutting edge technology." The technology is not new. Copper wire goes back to Tesla and Edison. "It will bring competitive prices to Lakewood. Both AT&T and COX Communications stated publicly "There will be no price war or reduction in prices." "The technology is amazing and what it offers." The technology is vapor and does not exist yet as far as I can see from the AT&T site. "Will you give service in poorer areas?" The answer was yes we will make it available. Sure but at $90 a month! "Are the boxes dangerous as they have to be labeled HAZARD?" No, half the voltage as an air-conditioner. Well I am sure they meant half the voltage as a central air-conditioner, as the boxes are 110, and we all know what happens to the lights when our window unit kicks in. The whole house flickers. Besides it's the AMPs not the volts that kill. That number is impossible to find. While COX Communications' Lakewood represnetatives signed-on and posted to answer questions, AT&T's rep Dennis Dunn, who has been a Observer member for a long time, called Ken Warren and had him post his response! AT&T which recently changed it's rules to make it OK to share any and all subscriber information with government or anyone else that suits their business needs, could be the real nightmare. Do we really want to sign up for TV and Internet only to be spammed to death with advertisements on-line, on TV and in our mail?

What was even far more worrying was that it seemed only Mike Dever understood what the vote was about. A savings of $14,000 MAYBE. Ed Fitzgerald, and Kevin Butler mentioned not wanting to be put on AT&T's time restraints, but then voted for it. While no one would have graduated from Law School in two weeks, it would have brought much clarification, and given council a least another hour to find out what was going on. The firm Lakewood hired has a hard and set rule for helping a city with these projects. Everyone at the table, 6-13 months of public discussion, a real and true business plan looking at EVERYTHING. This was thrown out because this was a telephone company offering cable TV, not a cable TV company offering telephone service!

On a personal level which is even more troubling to me and shows me the measure of people and companies. Cox Communications started advertising with LO and has gone on to exceed their agreement and wants to help Lakewood residents not just get info out, but help work side by side with us to build the Lakewood Brand.

AT&T made a deal with LO, and as soon as the vote was approved broke their word and commitment to Lakewood residents and to this civic journalism project.

COX it would seem is not just into it for the money. They are looking to be part of a community they have GIVEN millions of dollars of FREE service to.

As far as the way council and the law department looked for a way around the contract it would be like coming home to my beautiful wife with her beautiful brown eyes and saying, "It wasn't cheating, she had blue eyes not brown."

Choice seems easy enough to me.
Cox - Faster service, fiber optic, part of the community, gives until it hurts, working hard to make the city better, cleaner and build the Brand.

AT&T - Big dangerous green boxes all over the city, they do not even need to remove if they bail like they did in Fairview.

Lakewood loses. A city with our density should be getting FREE service and be used as an advertisement for services. A potential 20,000 subscribers in 5.5 square miles is a dream come true for anyone that has to spend money from house to house.

But this vote is over and I will not be joining with the residents that want a chance to vote on this and maybe throw the deal out, much like the number thing from years ago.

Rocky River knows, there is no glamor being the cheapest whore in the area. When will Lakewood?


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Jim, I'd still like to know where these boxes are going to be located. That would incite a new interest and discussion on this topic. Imagine Edgewater, Lake and Clifton with those monsters. As people drive through Lakewood it will make quite a picture. We could line Franklin, Lakewood Hts. Blvd. and the North Marginal with them instead of guard rails. How about Riverside drive? They'll compliment the valley view nicely. Consider the impact on a neighborhood like Birdtown with small frontages.

How much does the ATT propensity to sue cities that are uncooperative play into this decision?

Where does this fit into our long range plan, community vision, mission? Where are the community impact meetings or studies? It was this kind of let them eat cake attitude that leads to ballot referendums. Have we learned nothing?

Suzanne

Suzanne Metelko wrote:I'm curious as to how many boxes there will be and where they will be located.

Well I am sure I know where 5 will be. Your yard, Ken's yard, Steve's yard, Dever's Yard(underground) and my yard.

I m not anti AT&T, but I am intensely loyal to friends.


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I think you are looking at this all wrong.

Think of hundreds of boxes, some being used as kiosks. A couple of welds to a steel U bolt, and you have city-wide bike racks. More flower baskets hanging from brackets on every street corner. Art competitions to paint and decorate (instead of guitars or park benches). Places to lease advertising space for garage sales, weld on a wire rack and we have all the points for distribution of the LO that we'll ever need...the possibilites are absolutely endless. Admittedly, there's the high voltage issue, but some grounded rubber mulch should take care of that. Boy, for people who pride themselves at thinking out of the box, you guys sure are missing out on a great opportunity.

Jeff

Jeff, you're right - we're thinking about the outside of the box, not outside the box. So here goes - would a sudden, significant drop in ATT households result in their walking away from the deal?

Question at this point in the discussion:

I understand the frustration over the rush for approval from council, the lack of public input and discussion on the issue.

And this is precisely why I am so hesitant to allow these same representatives the power to hire a city manager, much less develop the directives that the manager would institute.

I know its off thread, but then again it's demonstrative of the manner in which council handles important issues.

Okay, resume discussion of ATT.....sorry for the interruption.

Jeff

Jeff,

Ok, I'll see your off topic and raise you two comments.

The upside of council making these decisions is that we know who is accountable.

With responsiblilities clearly defined and accountability clearly established, I believe we're going to see a larger pool of qualified people, who would not step into the current partisan quicksand, come forth because the opportunity to work together in a respectful, professional environment with a common focus (what is good for Lakewood) will begin to evolve.

Back to ATT.

Suzanne Metelko wrote:Jeff,

Ok, I'll see your off topic and raise you two comments.

The upside of council making these decisions is that we know who is accountable.

With responsibilities clearly defined and accountability clearly established, I believe we're going to see a larger pool of qualified people, who would not step into the current partisan quicksand, come forth because the opportunity to work together in a respectful, professional environment with a common focus (what is good for Lakewood) will begin to evolve.

Back to ATT.

Suzanne/Jeff

We probably should start another thread, but, DL is on vacation, so while the cat's away the mice will play.

I know that all three of us believe in living in the city if you work for the city. I have spoken with both of you about incentives to get police, fire and teachers to move into the 'wood. That the city would be far better off with let's 70 police, 70 fireman and as many as 500 teachers living in amongst the people they work for. We all agree, correct?

So with that thought in mind, where does the City Manager come from? How big is that pool?

Back to AT&T

I want to clarify. AT&T was coming in no matter what. AT&T will offer other choices, and more is usually better. My main problem with the vote was that we had/have a long history with Cox Communications and a contract of good faith. I think it would have more proper to offer a little defense, uphold the essence of the contract and hold AT&T to the same as Cox Communications.

Little things in the AT&T deal bother me and should have bothered others. One is pulling out and not having to remove their boxes. Another was no commitment to the schools, library and city hall outside of; If Cox Communications sues, AT&T will cover the legal expenses. No one mentioned or though of, what if Cox Communications removes their service and does not sue? Who picks up 74, the TV studio at Lakewood High, the fiber optic network between the schools, library and city hall?

The way I read the contract if Cox Communications just drops the services it triggers nothing in the AT&T contract.

Also what message does it send to other potential giants that look at working with Lakewood?

I have spoken with the Corrigans at Lakewood's Law Department. They worked long and hard on this deal. They have assured me Lakewood is covered, the library is covered and the schools are covered. They are much smarter than I, and were at all the meetings. So I take them at their word. Likewise with Council, they sat through the meetings and the discussion. I did not. So I hope and believe they know far more about this than I. Dennis Dunn has always served the city well, lives here and I doubt that he would "sell out" the city. So I have to believe they are correct.

But Mike Dever did raise two great points. 1) We should work with AT&T to make sure 100% of all the boxes are underground. They did say they could do at least 4 underground, why not ALL? 2) Why turn our back on Cox Communications, and push this through if the only real loss was a possible check for $14,000 from AT&T to cover legal expenses.

Let's be honest, if Cox Communications can afford it, then AT&T could afford twice as much. Cox is big, AT&T is very very very big.

I think Lakewood groups including City Hall, is still not willing to deal from our strength. So there is constant efforts to grab low hanging fruit, and get it before they run or they might say no. Lakewood needs to get a little more edgy. Especially in the coming years as I hear more and more people talk about privatizing parts of city services.

FWIW


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