The Observation Deck

Jim -

I still fervently believe they are racist, but you are entitled to your opinion as are Bret and Charlie.

I just want people to ask themselves the questions I've asked and see what they come up with.

I still fail to see what this has to do with the color of the presidents skin.

But I'll ask again.

Sharon, Do you believe me to be a racist.

If that's what you think, then at least have the spine to come out and put it on the table.

As I've said before, while I cannot speak for the rest of the participants, the only reason I did not attend a rally previously, is because I did not yet feel pushed to the point where I was left with little other option. When Bush started cutting checks to every major bank and business with a big payroll I got ticked off. When Obama promised "CHANGE" I was willing to give him a chance to prove it. But now that he has demonstrated no real interest in changing direction, just changing pace, it was time to look into other options.

Show me what this has to do with skin color?

Why was this not done earlier? It was.

How do conservatives protest? They don't stand in picket lines, they rarely grab a megaphone and take to the streets, they voice their protest at the poles. And guess what, in the last two election cycles, they did exactly that. And as a result, the Democrats took office.

What? You think that some great groundswell of new liberal voters appeared out of nowhere to tip the scales? No. The difference was made by the massive number of disgruntled conservatives that started abandoning their typical partisan positions and looking to alternative leadership. They voted Libertarian, they voted Independent, and yes, some even voted Democrat. And the result of their silent protest was heard. Loud and Clear.

Pelosi, Frank, Obama took over. Congratulations, the Democratic party took control of Washington.

and then?

nothing changed.

Bush put together a MASSIVE SPENDING PACKAGE as a lame duck. He virtually tee'd up a softball for Obama to knock out of the park. He could have easily stepped in crushed it. Immediately separating himself from the very thing he campaigned against. But he didn't, he doubled down.

You claim that he has cut taxes to the middle class. Well, whoopdi-freakin-do. He's only robbing Peter to pay Paul. This stimulus package is the equivelant of an unemployed person paying himself to work on his own house. "gosh, if I pay myself $10 an hour, I promise that I'll put $1 of each paycheck into my savings account."

So if they cut taxes, yet spending keeps going up, and the employment rate keeps going down. WHERE THE HELL DOES THE MONEY COME FROM?

I think people also need to take into account that they guy has been in office for less than 3 month. He can not save us from ourselves that quick

No one should expect results that quickly, but with how slow this massive ship takes to change course, someone should at least start turning the wheel soon.

But that's just the opinion of a man who's recently found out that the only reason I'm upset is because my president is half African.

In good news, I was pleased to hear that Obama hired a former CEO to hold the OMB more accountable and look for greater efficiencies in the government.

Promises of re-instituting pay-go, in the right hands, would be encouraging. In this administration, if that doesn't mean creating new taxes to pay for spending programs, I'll be shocked.

Bret -

There are a number of things I could say to you, but I don't need to.

For the last time, you went to something that the Minutemen are involved in.

Old saying, you are judged by the company you keep.

You choose who you wish to associate with as do I. I wouldn't be within spitting, and I mean spitting distance of that group of bigots, but you support something they are intrinsically involved in.

Have at it.

I believe that the Minutemen are racists. You keep company with them when you are involved in these events.

Okay, so, now the thought process is something to the effect of...

I went to the tea party. The tea party is run by Minutemen. The Minutemen are Bigots.

Therefor I'm either supporting or am myself a racist?

Just curious, can you back up any of those statements with some evidence supporting the conclusion? I'll spot you the first one, since I've already admitted to attending the tea party.

Also curious, isn't that whole "judged by the company you keep" argument the same one the Republicans trotted out when the whole Rev. Wright thing came out?

In my case, I'll promise you the following. If it can be shown, that the people running these tea parties do indeed have a morally, legally or even religiously questionable agenda, I will not associate myself with anything to do with them.

But i'd like you to fill me in on where you got the information regarding their connections to bigotry, racism or even the Minuteman project.

After Sharon’s post, I did some poking around on the web. There have been a handful of Minutemen caught using racial slurs against Mexicans and that has been used by liberals to say all Minutemen are bigots. I haven’t found any evidence (other than opinions and blogs) that says the entire Minuteman project is a front for a group hell bent on bigotry.

As far as the Tea Party is concerned, there have been a few instances where the Minutemen have changed their planned time and place of demonstration to the same time and place where a Tea Party is scheduled. However, I found no direct link between the organizers of Tea Party and the organizers of the Minutemen. It appears the Minutemen are interested in capitalizing on the media coverage of the Tea Party to further their own agenda. There is no direct link between Minutemen and Tea Party organizers.

Someone please correct me if I don’t have the complete picture (and also post the evidence).

I have never been to a tea party.

Where the heck did you get that Bret?

I don't move in those circles, but I follow anything that has to do with Minutemen, Neo-Nazis and the Ku Klux Klan.

I have for over 40 years. I like to know where my enemies are.

Cite references where they haven't.

The two of you (Bret and Charlie) seem to think that you can issue orders.

Wow!!

have never been to a tea party.

Where the heck did you get that Bret?

Please re-read the thread, I never suggested that you had.

Cite references where they haven't

.

we're not the ones making accusations of bigotry and racism.

If you want me to cite my source for the suggestion that the Tea Party was fairly non-partisan and not just an "anti-Obama" rally, well then, I'd have to go with... MYSELF

If you had any actual proof to back up your statements, I would think that it would be as easy as linking us to a website that shows the connection. Yet you instead fall back on a position of feigned indignation to the brashness that someone actually has the gall of expecting you to walk the walk, and not just talk the talk.

You have the right to your beliefs, but before you go throwing around such inciteful comments such as "racist" and "bigot", it would be grossly irresponsible not to, first, have your facts (or at the very least, a strong argument) in order.

Well, if I must, here's one -

http://www.democraticunderground.com/di ... 385x298931

A little something re: Minutemen -

http://www.cjonline.com/news/local/2009 ... statehouse

Here's the website for the Minute Men. Make sure you scroll all the way down the page and look at the left hand side -

http://www.minutemanproject.com/images/ ... aparty.asp

[quote]About 65 people gathered on the Statehouse grounds late Saturday morning for a “tea partyâ€

I'm asking you to show me how the intent of these rallies was racist and you show me a link to Jeneanne Garofolo and stuff that shows that some guys that may or may not be xenophobes MIGHT have attended a couple of the events?

why didn't you just tell me that the dog ate your research.

Seriously.

If I was making similar accusations and you ask me for evidence, what would you say if my response was to point to a Bill O'Reilly commentary?

Thanks, I havn't laughed this hard in a while.