Lakewood Not Walkable for Seniors

[Ryan Salo]

I still like my pocket seat advertisement.

This grassy area in front of Westerly would seat a lot of folks using these seats.

pocketseat.jpg (37.64 KiB) Viewed 2876 times

(DISCLAIMER***This is just to be funny, not to make fun of anyone or any idea)

[Will Brown]

This subject was started by a rant from Sharon Kinsella concerning how she was allegedly treated by a council member. She subsequently revealed that her call had been on behalf of an acquaintance who was unable to walk from the senior city housing to the hospital. Now, its been some years since my grandfather lived there, and perhaps things have changed, but I recall that there was plenty of transportation available when any resident wanted to go anywhere, and we already pay a lot for that transportation. It has gotten to the point where too many of us dump our parents and grandparents into these facilities, and count on the facility to provide the support that, in a civilized society, the family would be expected to provide.

When we undertake to provide support services for all elderly persons, not just for those who have no family, it becomes a very expensive system. And the seniors do not hesitate to make demands. When transportation is available, they choose to walk, even though they can't, so they want benches, and when we don't have an unbroken string of benches, they will probably demand moving sidewalks. This is a group that has, if reports are to be believed, a high level of discretionary income, at least higher than young people who are raising kids, yet they are reluctant to spend their own money.

More benches may or may not be a good idea. My observation is that places that have a lot of inclement weather (i.e., severe winters) don't have as many benches as more temperate places. Winter makes the benches unusable, and often damages them. So it would seem to make more sense to invest in something that would serve year-round.

I think what made this thread contentious is Sharon Kinsella. If she is to be believed, she "doesn't yell" at an awful lot of people, yet somehow is involved in a lot of confrontations. Sometimes what may be a good idea is viewed as a bad idea because of the character of the advocate.

[Gary Rice]

There's something about being sick, infirm, temporarily or permanently in need of assistance, and especially, with being elderly....

For myself, I would certainly want to be cautious about attempting to generalize categories of people, because so often, we may find ourselves ending up in those very categories.

The thing is, sooner or later, whatever our income level, and whatever our political or personal philosophy might be, we each will find, at some point, that circumstances will arise where we just won't always be able to pull ourselves up by our own proverbial bootstraps.

When that happens, we do begin to understand and deeply appreciate why services like transportation, or even a few convenient benches are important to other people.

Fortunately, Lakewood's Office on Aging does have many wonderful services for seniors. (that I've outlined for our readers in a recent article in the Lakewood Observer)

Not being party to the exchange originally brought up in this thread, I would not want to comment on it, other than to surmise that something in that original interchange obviously did not go as well as it could have.

As far as the question of "bullying" goes, sometimes this 'Deck reminds me of an unsupervised group of children. Confrontational or polemical posturing does not good neighbors make, nor does it particularly solve anything. So far as I am aware, no one is paid to espouse a party line here, so why do some people persist in doing it? Adding to all of this, there appears to be a glaring lack of respect on the part of a number of people here for the thoughts and opinions of others. Rather than making the point that they would like to make, I believe that some of those same people unwittingly degrade their own positions by their polemical exercises in negative verbosity towards the thoughts of others.

All of this brings to mind the age-old expressions that traditionally describe the behaviors of certain elements in our society...attention-seekers, muckrakers, rabble-rousers... That laundry list is long indeed, but, were I a moderator for this deck, the one thing that I would not tolerate would be any form of sarcasm, bullying, degrading, or abusive language towards anyone here.

When principles become more important than people, that's when the trouble seems to begin...

No one needs to be subjected to bullying, being singled out, or being a victim of verbal abuse at any time, anywhere.

Lakewood is not just for one class, demographic, age group, or political power base. Lakewood is for all of us.

That should be obvious and infractions on this 'Deck should be immediately addressed by administrators here, whenever they occur. Perhaps they are already addressing this sort of thing on a quiet case-by-case basis.

That point made, I do think that there may have been entirely too many foxes in this hen-house lately.

No banjo right now. This topic's far too serious for a sing-a-long.

All just my opinion, but I may be right.

[Gary Rice]

The precautionary point made about benches being too close to the street is certainly a valid one. The concept of street-side benches would have to be studied and researched before being implemented. They would have to be as safe as possible, for the benefit of all concerned.

Perhaps park benches having a sturdy back towards the street would be a bit safer, as people getting up from them would be moving their bodies away from traffic. Better still for street-side benches would perhaps be a well-built 3-sided protective fence between the bench and traffic. Perhaps there are laws and rules governing these types of public seating arrangements?

As far as funding benches goes, in other communities, I've seen benches having plaques indicating that they were sponsored by businesses or private individuals. We actually have a precedent for doing that sort of thing in Lakewood with our newly refurbished Veteran's Park bench area in Lakewood Park.

If a business would be allowed to do so, placing a courtesy bench (not street-side, but right next to their business) besides those flower pots (that seem to sprout around this town like daffodils...) just might work. You can't sit on a flower pot, after all, and both customers and passers-by would probably appreciate the thoughtfulness involved on the part of that business.

A great example of public benches already shown in this thread would be that beautiful area of 3 recessed benches away from traffic, in front of Congressman Kucinich's office. I see people sitting there frequently, enjoying life.

Now, back to the banjo...

[Roy Pitchford]

I think what made this thread contentious is Sharon Kinsella. If she is to be believed, she "doesn't yell" at an awful lot of people, yet somehow is involved in a lot of confrontations. Sometimes what may be a good idea is viewed as a bad idea because of the character of the advocate.

I am shocked, shocked to hear this assertion leveled against Sharon!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SjbPi00k_ME

[J Hrlec]

Time out people!

[Valerie Molinski]

I just wanted to add the following information and conjecture to the topic at hand.

I used a GPS to measure distances this morning. From the North Westerly towers to the intersection of Detroit and Belle is .15 miles. If you cross the street and walk up to the main entrance of the hospital, where the drop off is, it is another .20 miles approximately. Total- .35 miles

I, too, noticed that there are no benches at the front of any of the Westerly properties, which should be remedied by the property owners. I often see senior residents (or I think they are) sitting in the bus shelter and it would be nice if they had somewhere else for outdoor space to just enjoy the day, right outside their door.

As an ambulatory person, .35 miles does not appear too challenging, but I will tell you, from the Westerly to Belle is a downward slope, and the sidewalk itself is atrocious. Can you imagine going down that with a walker or a wheelchair? And then there is an uphill on Belle to the entrance of the hospital that was in better shape. But either way, you are walking, there is at least one uphill to contend with and lots of heaved sidewalks, which is not safe for anyone.

The city could do a lot by trying to improve the quality of those areas that go beyond benches. And I do agree with DL, that I hope the conversation was a little more civil and less dismissive as reported here. Even when things are not feasible, our council still should listen to its constituents and try to come up with some helpful solutions. I am not saying this wasn't attempted in this case, as I am not involved. I just hope that we do try to do that in this city. Everyone should be heard, no matter who is on the other end of the phone line.

[Corey Rossen]

I still like my pocket seat advertisement.

This grassy area in front of Westerly would seat a lot of folks using these seats.

pocketseat.jpg

(DISCLAIMER***This is just to be funny, not to make fun of anyone or any idea)

That seriously looks like Dick Van Dyke well past the Mary Poppins years.

[Ryan Salo]

Jim where did your post go? Accountability to words? I am glad you removed it though, it wasn't nice.

Still waiting for an explanation...

[Stephen Eisel]

Jim where did your post go? Accountability to words? I am glad you removed it though, it wasn't nice.

Still waiting for an explanation...

It obviously turned into a transparent post

[dl meckes]

Sullivan's has a bench. Not a very big area, but they have a bench.

Maybe the "Time Out" bench is a good idea. Art benches, similar to the New Orleans Ya/Ya chairs, could do a lot of good for Lakewood.

[sharon kinsella]

Will Brown -

I don't like to be referred to as lying. Shawn Juris did speak to me like that and I was calling for a friend.

Why would I lie?

Also people doing virtual walks should do what Valerie did and really walk. Even better, come over to the Westerly and talk to the tenants about it. Seeing as you don't trust me get someone else's word for it.

What good does the Westerly or S. Westerly putting up benches do when we need them halfway to the hospital and down Detroit in order to be able to walk in this unwalkable environment?

[Valerie Molinski]

I find it funny that we are always telling the elderly (and I do this with my parents) that they need to be more active and walk more so their muscles don't atrophy- one good fall could put someone in a tail spin towards worse health issues.

And then we sit here and tell people to get a cab or a bus because they shouldn't be walking anyway to their doctor's appointments a block away. People need to try and stay active for as long as possible to remain healthy.

[Ryan Salo]

Not a very big area, but they have a bench.

I guess this depends on your definition of a "big area".

The distance from the side of the building to the edge of the curb in front of Sullivan's is 14 1/2 ft.

The distance from the edge of the building where 2 dad's is on Detroit to the edge of the curb is only 8 ft and the south side of the street only has 9 ft.

I am not trying to be a pain, but to suggest there is enough room for benches on most of Detroit is just not possible without creating other risks.

Maybe some of these active folks that want to walk but can't physically do it for long should consider a walker with a seat. Here is a Google search with quite a few options.

http://www.google.com/search?gcx=w&sour ... 80&bih=989

Maybe the facilities where they live could invest in a couple and everyone could share, I am sure they don't all go out at the same time.

[Danielle Masters]

That does seems like a narrow area for a bench. Many of the sidewalks in Lakewood are narrow enough as it is. I remember the years of trying to walk down the street with a double stroller, in many areas it was not easy. Perhaps this is something that could be done in the areas with wider sidewalks but I don't think it something that should be on the city's shoulders. If done it should be done by private parties. I do have to wonder why the Westerly has all that grass without any benches, it would be nice for people to sit outside during the nice weather.