Where On Earth Is Dennis Kucinich?

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 7:55 pm

Scott MacGregor wrote:Dennis is running for President --so going to Syria is just a way he can be seen on the international stage. He's an American, he has the freedom to do that.

He deserves all of the praise and criticism he gets.

What bothers me is the opinion that we shouldn't be talking to the Syrians or the Iranians.

Sure they're scoundrels! So were the Nazis but we talked to them.

So are the North Koreans but we talked and talked and talked to them.

So were the North Vietnamese but we talked to them.

The only differences between Iraq and those other wars are in the body counts.

Do we always have to lose Biblical numbers of our best and brightest before we decide to sit down and talk about it with our enemies?

C'mon for pete's sake--without the establishment of a dialogue with the inhabitants of the Middle Eastern world --this conflict will go on and the body count will continue to rise and this war will become a struggle passed from generation to generation.

Talk to the scoundrels! I don't like the bastards either but my children's future is at stake here.

Nobody said that Dennis was not free to go to Syria. Yes, he went to Syria between sessions of congress (I think). And how many other Presidential candidates went to Syria to talk to Asad? How many other presidential candidates have gone to visit heads of terrorist states while running for president? He has no power or authority to negotiate with Syria either as a congressman or presidential candidate. He was there representing himself. It was a fruitless trip. His time could have been better spent working on the issues that are impacting his district right now. Your WWII analogy is weak at best. I do not recall any renegade presidential candidates or congressman visiting Hitler during WWII and telling Hitler that WWII was all wrong and that the US should withdraw its troops.

American Deaths from other wars:
1775-1783 American Revolution 4,435
1812-1815 War of 1812 2,260
1846-1848 Mexican War 13,283
1861-1865 Civil War 558,052
1898 Spanish American War 2,446
1914-1918 World War I 116,708
1939-1945 World War II 407,316
1950-1953 Korean Conflict 33,651
1957-1975 Vietnam Conflict 58,168
1991 Gulf War 293
Gulf War II 3,774

Scott MacGregor · Post by **Scott MacGregor** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 8:36 pm

read my message again stephen. Dennis Kucinich is a side show. I dealt with his publicity stunt in the first sentence. My message isn't about Dennis. It is about establishing dialogue with those that hate us.

What I am implying is that there is not a military solution to the middle eastern question unless your solution involves the total annihilation of the Arabic race.

Also, there were many instances in history of open channels, secret and otherwise, with both the Germans and the Japanese throughout the WWII over matters ranging from treatment of prisoners to varying forms of surrender.

It didn't prevent the atom bomb but you would think that since 1945 we would have learned a few lessons about how to win the peace.

Jeff Endress · Post by **Jeff Endress** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 8:50 pm

I do not recall any renegade presidential candidates or congressman visiting Hitler during WWII

So. You're suggesting that we're at war with Syria? :shock:

Interesting

As far as actions of some Americans, before (and during) WWII, what about the Americans First? Didn't that include a number of Senators, Gerald Ford, (future Congressman, VP and President) Potter Steart (supreme Court) Sens. Burton Wheeler, Gerald Nye, Charles Lindbergh, Walt Disney.....Not sure if they talked to Hitler, but they sure did their damnest to scuttle Lend-Lease and tried to enforce the neutrality act....obvious comforts to the Reich...

Jeff

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 9:17 pm

Scott MacGregor wrote:read my message again stephen. Dennis Kucinich is a side show. I dealt with his publicity stunt in the first sentence. My message isn't about Dennis. It is about establishing dialogue with those that hate us.

What I am implying is that there is not a military solution to the middle eastern question unless your solution involves the total annihilation of the Arabic race.

Also, there were many instances in history of open channels, secret and otherwise, with both the Germans and the Japanese throughout the WWII over matters ranging from treatment of prisoners to varying forms of surrender.

It didn't prevent the atom bomb but you would think that since 1945 we would have learned a few lessons about how to win the peace.

I was not clear in my post (my bad). I agree with you that Dennis trip to Syria was a stunt. I was making clear why the trip was a waste and that Dennis was not repping the US.

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 9:29 pm

Jeff Endress wrote:
I do not recall any renegade presidential candidates or congressman visiting Hitler during WWII

So. You're suggesting that we're at war with Syria? Interesting

As far as actions of some Americans, before (and during) WWII, what about the Americans First? Didn't that include a number of Senators, Gerald Ford, (future Congressman, VP and President) Potter Steart (supreme Court) Sens. Burton Wheeler, Gerald Nye, Charles Lindbergh, Walt Disney.....Not sure if they talked to Hitler, but they sure did their damnest to scuttle Lend-Lease and tried to enforce the neutrality act....obvious comforts to the Reich...

Jeff

Jeff, we are at war with terrorism. Syria has and is sponsoring terrorism. Syria has taken hostile actions toward Coalition forces in Iraq. Syria allowed military equipment to flow into Iraq on the eve of and during this war. Syria also permitted Al Qaeda and other volunteers to pass into Iraq to attack our service members during the war.

The Baath party is also the preferred party in Syria like it was in Iraq (the official party of Saddam)

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Tue Sep 11, 2007 9:36 pm

Scott, I think that the US is going to let Israel take care of Syria. I do not think that the US is going to do any real talking with Iran or Syria as long as they are assisting the enemy in Iraq and sponsoring terrorism. Tough call! Do we negotiate with terrorist or countries that sponsor terrorism?

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 11:54 am

Did Dennis commit a felony and violate the Logan Act?

Logan Act overview (clicky)

Any citizen of the United States, wherever he may be, who, without
authority of the United States, directly or indirectly commences or carries on any
correspondence or intercourse with any foreign government or any officer or
agent thereof, in relation to any disputes or controversies with the United States,
or to defeat the measures of the United States, shall be fined under this title or
imprisoned not more than three years, or both.

Frank Murtaugh · Post by **Frank Murtaugh** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 6:26 pm

Mr. Kucinich, a member of the U.S. Congress, visited the terrorist supporting enemy nation of Syria. There he appeared on national television and criticized the United States of America. He stated the US is responsible for the deaths of up to one million Iraquis. He also made statements wherein he essentially acted as an apologist for the Assad regime. His statements are ripe for propoganda use by our vicious enemies in the middle east and around the world.

There is no precedent for this type of action by a member of Congress in the annals of American history.

Mr. Kucinich, many know, has fine qualities. However, during his Syrian trip, Mr. Kucinich crossed the line. He went beyond the pale. He needs to be so advised by his dedicated admirers and followers.

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 6:51 pm

Dennis Kucinich is no Ben Franklin, Thomas Jefferson or Ghandi. He was not going to France but to a nation that supports terrorism. A nation that is assisting in the slaughter of our American soldiers. I have watched the video several times and have read the transcript. Did Dennis ever once address the fact that Syria is letting terrorist into Iraq to fight and kill our soldiers? Is he really working for world peace when he does not address the fact that Syria is helping to bring instability to Iraq?

Gary Rice · Post by **Gary Rice** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:11 pm

I just finished watching the video.

I deleted my post at the same time Frank quoted it. I figured the post to be more of a historical reference, and therefore not really germain to the discussion at hand.

Like so many others who have taken positions that were controversial, Dennis will be judged by what he said and did, by scholars, historians, and the American people.

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 7:40 pm

Gary Rice wrote:I just finished watching the video.

I deleted my post at the same time Frank quoted it. I figured the post to be more of a historical reference, and therefore not really germain to the discussion at hand.

Like so many others who have taken positions that were controversial, Dennis will be judged by what he said and did, by scholars, historians, and the American people.

He did more than take a position. He committed treason.

Dustin James · Post by **Dustin James** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:16 pm

Gary Rice wrote:I just finished watching the video.

I deleted my post at the same time Frank quoted it. I figured the post to be more of a historical reference, and therefore not really germain to the discussion at hand.

Like so many others who have taken positions that were controversial, Dennis will be judged by what he said and did, by scholars, historians, and the American people.

I have to agree and also viewed this video several times (Pepto was near by just in case).

You can't write this stuff, you really can't.

The Republicans in their wildest dreams could not order up a more perfect rube. Let's review. Mr. Kucinich has just enough credentials to actually get on Syrian TV. Many cheese farmers from Wisconsin and nuclear physicists would have been turned down cold.

Why? because they knew precisely what to expect from this guy without the hassles of editing out unfriendly things like warring with Israel and supporting terrorists havens. He blathers on about how America is wrong, how Bush is wrong, how the taking out of Hussein was wrong (all based on lies about WMD which his party totally signed on to, but cannot seem to remember that commitment). The rapt emotional focus of the pretty Syrian newscaster throwing softball after powderpuff just doesn't get much better. Would you like door number one, or door number two...come on down!

The Republicans get what I would call free sedation. Like the mysterious and huge amounts of Qualudes that flowed into college campuses across Ohio colleges after Kent State. It was amazing... the calming effect that draped over a volatile mental atmosphere.

The Syrians viewing it got some sense that this guy means something....because after all he's on TV! He represents a new pro-Syrian/Arab view that ..you know, we in the US really want to be liked again - and this terrorism crap is just some overblown lie.

We love you people...really! There won't be any Logan act against Denny, because he is so predictably unimportant, so righteous in his narcissistic goals of I'M the really smart diplomat...just look at MY credentials... (loved the reparations part for the Iraqis... because US blood and sacrifice really doesn't cut it... we need to buy people off).. he was perfect!

You can't write it better than this... money well spent if THEY think we really are just a little confused and it's all about Bush

Priceless.

.

Gary Rice · Post by **Gary Rice** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:22 pm

I tend to agree with the position expressed on another thread that officially crossing the line would mean attempting to represent the United States Government's interests as an unauthorized private citizen.

I don't believe that Dennis was trying to represent or negotiate for the Government here.

Having said that,

I do agree that he should have stayed home.

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:25 pm

There must be something in the Kool-Aid this month.

Deval Patrick (clicky here)

terrorist attacks that killed nearly 3,000 people resulted "from a failure of human understanding."

Stephen Eisel · Post by **Stephen Eisel** » Wed Sep 12, 2007 8:32 pm

These type of statements do not help the Democratic party...