Can City Council see next fleet of vehicles are electric?

[Donald Farris]

Hi,
I was reading this http://carrollgardens.patch.com/articles/its-electric-3. There is no reason the next purchase/lease of vehicles done by the City are not with Electric vehicles.

This is just good government. And while crunching the numbers would be needed, I can not believe it would be cheaper to run a fleet of gas guzzlers.

Great campaign material too. "I'm GREEN".

[stephen davis]

Stability and peace in our land will not come from the barrel of a gun, because peace without justice is an impossibility.
--Desmond Tutu

"Clean and green in our land will not come from the battery of a car, because batteries without pollution is an impossibility."
--Desmond Tutu (With minor edits.)

What third world country will we ship our old batteries to for disposal?

All for "green", when it really is.

Steve

.

[Valerie Molinski]

Stability and peace in our land will not come from the barrel of a gun, because peace without justice is an impossibility.
--Desmond Tutu

"Clean and green in our land will not come from the battery of a car, because batteries without pollution is an impossibility."
--Desmond Tutu (With minor edits.)

What third world country will we ship our old batteries to for disposal?

All for "green", when it really is.

Steve

.

That. And my other issue with electric cars is that we are merely shifting demand to another non-renewable resource that also creates CO2 emission- coal.

[Jerry Ritcey]

I think the key may be truly efficient batteries, which so far has been pretty elusive. It would make it possible to "save" power from solar/wind for night and when the wind is not blowing. It has some physics and engineering issues to get around first.

Once oil becomes too expensive, Uranium will power the world.

[J Hrlec]

Maybe they will be able to perfect the idea that actions of a vehicle, such as braking, can produce sufficient "power" to be used for other operations... therefore producing most of the energy needed to power itself.

On a related note, I did like how city hall is thinking (or already is using?) a truck which can swap out the utility parts or shell of the vehicle for various uses. A leaf collection unit can be swapped out for a salt dumper and plow for the winter, etc, etc. Means less vehicles and maintenance needed.

[Donald Farris]

Hi,
I share a concern for the proper disposal of the batteries from these vehicles. I have made the same statement of concern. The process of disposal can be corrected.

Is it more dangerous for some one to be possibly poisoned a decade from now by the improper disposal of a dead battery or to be killed next week by wars we fight to maintain the flow of oil now.

The definition of insanity is doing the same thing over and over and expecting different results. America can not afford to continue sending all our money to dictators to be given their oil. We must use our minds to develop technological solutions. Like LED lights and electric vehicles.

True, electricity can be made from coal. But it can be made from a number of other sources. Many of those can be green.

Jay Leno has a Volt and I read he drives it everywhere. He said last year he bought 2 tanks of gas. If we can reduce the demand for oil, perhaps we can stop the next big future disaster (think Gulf Oil spill) or the next War for Oil (think hundreds of thousands of innocent people killed).

If we struggle with developing a green solution, lets take baby steps and start with a greener solution. Electric car is greener than a gas one.

As for nuclear power, we should never create something that we can not shutoff. We will be polluted by the nuclear disaster in Japan. The people can never go back to anywhere near that place. The disaster is not over, it is ongoing. Nuclear power plants are too dangerous and should be banned throughout the World.

[Thealexa Becker]

I respect the concern over dependence on foreign oil...but you all do realize that the top country that the US imports oil from is not in the middle east, right?

It's Canada. In fact the top 5 are Canada, Saudi Arabia, Mexico, Venezuela, and Nigeria.

I only see one middle eastern country in there. And it's a country that we aren't fighting in a war.

So the argument for green tech because we are dependent on oil from unfriendly countries is sadly inaccurate.

Green electric cars are not as great as they are cracked up to be. They are far more maintainence that we need for police cars. They aren't as reliable and do you really want the battery running out in the middle of an emergency response? No.

So until electric cars are more marketable and not as experimental, I don't think such an essential force should use them. Yet.

Who knows, maybe they will get better in the future, but they aren't now.

[Bill Call]

Hi,
Jay Leno has a Volt and I read he drives it everywhere. He said last year he bought 2 tanks of gas.

Does that include the miles he drives in his limos? How about his car collection, does that count:

http://www.germancarforum.com/pit-gener ... -leno.html

Leno bragging about his volt is a little like Al Gore talking about the need to be green. You know, the guy with the private jets and 100,000 square feet of housing who consumes more energy than some small towns.

If you are concerned about the environment then support the building of more nuclear power plants. If you are concerned about energy independence then oppose Obama's war on coal. Making the City waste money on electric vehicles serves no useful purpose.

Lakewood is already greener than most cities because it is densely populated with just about everything within easy walking distance and short driving distance. If you are concerned about the environment then encourage council to publicly oppose things like Tri-C's new Lorain County campus that encourage the abandonment of the central core.

[Valerie Molinski]

True, electricity can be made from coal. But it can be made from a number of other sources. Many of those can be green.

Jay Leno has a Volt and I read he drives it everywhere. He said last year he bought 2 tanks of gas.
If we struggle with developing a green solution, lets take baby steps and start with a greener solution. Electric car is greener than a gas one.

As it currently stands, electric cars are not that much greener than a gas one. They are currently only marginally better. You need to look at and factor in more than the energy the car actually uses. You need to think about resources and embodied energy in overall manufacture of the vehicle as well. It takes a tremendous amount of energy to manufacture EV batteries. I agree with you that we need to continue this technology so that it can get better and better. We will eventually be there, I think, but not right now.

True, we can get electricity from other sources. But you are talking about a LOCAL fleet, which would get its energy from First Energy. First Energy's main source is coal burning. They do invest in green energy, but not much. They merely buy it from other producers (at the minimum they are required by federal mandate) and do not currently produce their own. 44107 currently gets over 70% of their electricity from coal derived sources.

Regarding Leno, have you seen his car collection and the size of his house? I don't think he is a good example to hold up for energy savings through EV's.

I think the answer might fall somewhere in between. Highly efficient gasoline engines that get crazy high mileage. We are getting there. Of course, the greenest car is the one not used. Maybe we can put more of our cops on bikes, or they can ride the bus to the scene. (KIDDING!)

[J Hrlec]

Maybe we can go back to horse drawn city vehicles?

[Stan Austin]

Doesn't that look just like Fire Chief Scott Gilman?!?!

[Thealexa Becker]

Maybe we can go back to horse drawn city vehicles?

These are actually worse for the environment than cars.

All of the waste produced is worse than greenhouse gas emission.

[Bill Call]

Maybe we can go back to horse drawn city vehicles?

These are actually worse for the environment than cars.

All of the waste produced is worse than greenhouse gas emission.

I don't know how you managed to get through school with you common sense thinking still intact.

In the 1890's horses produced nearly 2.5 million tons of manure per day:

http://www.thefreemanonline.org/columns ... s-of-1894/

[J Hrlec]

Maybe we can go back to horse drawn city vehicles?

These are actually worse for the environment than cars.

All of the waste produced is worse than greenhouse gas emission.

Heh... I knew someone would take it to the next level

Even though I assume the horses would exist whether we use them or not ...the extended benefits are good though:

- Manure for the community gardens
- "Meet the Trucks" event would be even more interesting
- No one would want to regionalize with our horse team
- Gives lakewoodites another reason to use the term "horses ass" other than describing local politicians

/tongueincheek

[Donald Farris]

Hi,
Ms. Becker, While we have been sold many lies for why America is at war (not real war, just bombing, killing and dying stuff), I believe oil plays a major part in our sending troops to Iraq, Afghanistan, and Libya. I'm not so sure about the other places I know of that we bomb and kill. How our leaders can spend trillions on death with no discussion about cutting back spending there, while having no problems actively calling to take away aid to the poor and elderly in America sickens me.

Want to hold the debt ceiling, stop these unauthorized wars.

Chevy Volts run on a electric or gas as a sources of power. I believe in electric mode they could outperform the existing police cars, at least at the low end where Lakewood Police use it. The best design are one's similar to the Chevy Volt or yet running on diesel.

Mr. Call, I respect your comments, but after Japan, you are still suggesting creating nuclear power plants? Please go here http://chernobyl2010.com/ or here http://www.huffingtonpost.com/2011/02/02/chernobyl-25-years-after-_n_816902.html#s233577 and look at how Chernobyl is 25 years after their disaster. Very few people are permitted within a 15mile radius of the plant. Japan's disaster is as bad, if not worse. Nuclear power is so dangerous, to use and then proper disposal. Odd in a thread where they are beating me up about disposing batteries someone would dare mention nuclear power that leaves a waste of a deadly dangerous byproduct for thousands of years that we still do not have a place to store.

Don't want to get power from FirstEnergy, then the City could build a wind farm out on the Lake. The Wind farm could feed power into the grid and take power out as needed. I believe one large windmill could supply all the power needed by the water treatment plant. Lakewood Power. Remember when they were wanting approval for the schools and were saying they would be green? They would be a lot greener with windmill power.

I know Jay Leno has many cars, and uses limos and flies in planes. But the Volt has him caring about his fuel usage. WOW!

From just an economical point of view running electric cars are cheaper and the City would be shielded from gas price jumps. Warranties cover the risk of mechanical problems.

Everyone could eat less meat, but that's a meaningful switch that even Al Gore didn't mention.