SLH comments on Firefighters Union position in support of Issue 64

[Dan Alaimo]

Seth Andregg, President of Lakewood Firefighters Association Local 382, has said the union is endorsing the 'For' Issue 64 position, saying it is the only way to ensure uninterrupted emergency room service during the transition to a new outpatient medical center and the only way to guarantee emergency services in Lakewood for years to come.

Kevin Young asked me to post Save Lakewood Hospital's response on the Deck:
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For Immediate Release —

We respect the dedication and hard work that all firefighters do to save lives. That said, Firefighters Union President Seth Andregg is incorrect when he says that Issue 64 is a “path to uninterrupted emergency care in Lakewood.” Andregg made this statement as part of a recent endorsement of voting For 64.

The master agreement specifically states that "the need for emergency services may change with time" and will be subject to "ongoing evaluation." This language allows the Cleveland Clinic to close Lakewood's ER at any time, as they have already done in Sagamore Hills just last year.

http://the-news-leader.com/news%20local ... sing-dec-1

In contrast to the statement by Andregg, the Ohio division of National Nurses United has endorsed voting against Issue 64.

For questions and comments, our contact information is below.

Kevin Young
Media Relations
Save Lakewood Hospital Committee
216-344-0743

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The SLH statement, including the pertinent section of the Master Agreement, is attached:

[Bridget Conant]

It's typical - for example, the construction unions will support this because it's work they'll get building the new facility. They don't care about the long range impact of it or the "fairness" of it, it simply means more work for them so they'll take it.

[Stan Austin]

Hey Seth Andregg--- Don't do a Loomis

[mjkuhns]

I would like to add that the first anyone on the Against 64 campaign heard of this was from media, contacting us for a response.

The union never gave notice that they were considering an endorsement, never asked us to meet them or present a case.

[m buckley]

Seth Andregg, President of Lakewood Firefighters Association Local 382, has said the union is endorsing the 'For' Issue 64 position, saying it is the only way to ensure uninterrupted emergency room service during the transition to a new outpatient medical center and the only way to guarantee emergency services in Lakewood for years to come.

Kevin Young asked me to post Save Lakewood Hospital's response on the Deck:
--
For Immediate Release —

We respect the dedication and hard work that all firefighters do to save lives. That said, Firefighters Union President Seth Andregg is incorrect when he says that Issue 64 is a “path to uninterrupted emergency care in Lakewood.” Andregg made this statement as part of a recent endorsement of voting For 64.

The master agreement specifically states that "the need for emergency services may change with time" and will be subject to "ongoing evaluation." This language allows the Cleveland Clinic to close Lakewood's ER at any time, as they have already done in Sagamore Hills just last year.

http://the-news-leader.com/news%20local ... sing-dec-1

In contrast to the statement by Andregg, the Ohio division of National Nurses United has endorsed voting against Issue 64.

For questions and comments, our contact information is below.

Kevin Young
Media Relations
Save Lakewood Hospital Committee
216-344-0743

Postby scott gilman » Fri Sep 09, 2016 12:26 pm

* * *
The ER at Lakewood continues to be a community asset and will remain that way if it is supported by the community

Despite repeated requests, this slip of a statement has gone without clarification by Mr. Gilman since September 9th.
It hangs there, like The Sword of Damocles over the heads of Lakewood residents. Presenting serious questions regarding the future of an ER in Lakewood.

[Michael Deneen]

Two things:

We all respect the police, but their unions endorse Trump.
I will not vote for Trump.

We all love firefighters, but this union endorsed 64.
I will not vote for 64.

We all saw what rank and file EMTs think with that unrehearsed testimonial video in 2015.

[Bridget Conant]

The rank and file do not always support the leadership's endorsements. In fact, most times, they aren't even asked - the "leaders" make the endorsements unilaterally.

[scott gilman]

Regarding comments alleging that the Lakewood Firefighters Union's support for Issue 64 is based upon a creation of more jobs for its members, Local 382 members will continue to have the same volume of work without the in-patient beds in Lakewood Hospital.

As far as the endorsement of the Ohio Division of National Nurses United, the question should be asked: What is their experience with day to day medical care in the City of Lakewood? Lakewood Firefighters provide medical care to the citizens of Lakewood on a daily basis and have first hand knowledge of their needs.

As to the edited video that was posted 18 months ago by a student doing a project on the Affordable Care Act and its impact, when the firefighters were asked to talk about the Affordable Care Act when they couldn't answer questions about that topic. They were then asked about the hospital situation. The answers they gave were given without any experience with the changes that were going to take place. So now 18 months later, the Union membership has experienced operating the EMS system with the in patient beds closed and they expressed support for the issue. They made an educated choice based on first hand experience providing EMS care.

[Bridget Conant]

the Union membership has experienced operating the EMS system with the in patient beds closed and they expressed support for the issue. They made an educated choice based on first hand experience providing EMS care.

So, can you confirm, did the membership vote on this endorsement?

[Michael Deneen]

Team Summers continuously claims that very few people read this forum, and that even fewer people that read it are undecided.

Yet magically their spokespeople appear here when they want to push a talking point.
Another example of of Team Summers' rhetoric not matching their actions.

As for this endorsement....it's not hard to connect the dots on this one.
Gilman works for the Mayor.
The Firemen and EMTs work for Gilman.
Noone wants to make their boss unhappy, especially if he has three years left in office.

[Brian Essi]

Regarding comments alleging that the Lakewood Firefighters Union's support for Issue 64 is based upon a creation of more jobs for its members, Local 382 members will continue to have the same volume of work without the in-patient beds in Lakewood Hospital.

As far as the endorsement of the Ohio Division of National Nurses United, the question should be asked: What is their experience with day to day medical care in the City of Lakewood? Lakewood Firefighters provide medical care to the citizens of Lakewood on a daily basis and have first hand knowledge of their needs.

As to the edited video that was posted 18 months ago by a student doing a project on the Affordable Care Act and its impact, when the firefighters were asked to talk about the Affordable Care Act when they couldn't answer questions about that topic. They were then asked about the hospital situation. The answers they gave were given without any experience with the changes that were going to take place. So now 18 months later, the Union membership has experienced operating the EMS system with the in patient beds closed and they expressed support for the issue. They made an educated choice based on first hand experience providing EMS care.

Chief Gilman,

It saddens me that the endorsement is based upon a lie that the leadership relied upon.

Since it is a fact that nobody besides CCF was ever asked to operate an ER, it is also a fact that the Master Agreement and passage of 64 are not the "only way to insure uninterrupted" emergency services.

So the endorsement is based on a false premise and means nothing except that your fine men are being used to mislead the public they so valiantly serve.

Are you able to answer Mr. Buckley's outstanding question about the viability of CCF's flimsy commitment to Lakewood?

[Lori Allen _]

First, I do not believe it was appropriate for the association to take a position on this. While this is not a knock on our firemen or paramedics, most of them do not even live in Lakewood. Second, I feel this creates a divide between citizens and safety forces, something that really shouldn't be happening right now. Finally, I recall that the Lakewood Firefighter's endorsed John Litten for Ward 3 council. Has Summers infiltrated the fireman's union now? What is next? The FOP? AFSCME? Who knows, maybe he will infiltrate the gates of Heaven and Hell next.

Who initiated the endorsement process? Seth Andregg? I have spoken with firemen from Lakewood, they have told me, off the record, that the setup in Lakewood is now a very dangerous situation. No, I will not give names or they will likely be fired tomorrow.

Finally, I would like this explained:

Gilman Certification 102616.jpg (95.71 KiB) Viewed 4605 times

In case that is too much to read, Mr. Gilman's license to practice as a paramedic in the State of Ohio appears to have expired on 07/08/2007, over nine years ago. The effective date of this license was 07/08/2004. Is it possible that Mr. Gilman has not sat for a paramedic test in twelve years? I also checked the Ohio State Medical Board and could not find any Dr. Scott Gilman M.D.'s licensed to practice in Ohio. Why then, does Mr. Gilman appear to be the EMS and paramedic spokesperson for City Hall and Mike Summers? Why is he going around to senior citizen facilities and speaking of EMS protocols, transport procedures, etc.? Why is he appearing on TV news with Mike Summers and appearing to do the same? How can he tell whether or not transport times are going to affect a patient's condition or prognosis?

At the very least, a certified paramedic with a current license should be doing this. Ideally however, it should be a medical doctor with no conflicts of interest (i.e. not a CCF doctor).

I'm sure I will be blasted for calling out Chief Gilman or something else. This is not an attack on him personally, but it is a legitimate concern and raises numerous questions. Is he supervising EMS procedures, protocols, and EMS personnel, apparently without a current license to practice as a paramedic or EMT himself? Why is he going around to senior buildings and going on TV and discussing transport times, procedures, etc., apparently without a current license?

Again, this is not a personal attack on Mr. Gilman. I still believe that our firemen and their procedures are wonderful. On the other hand, it raises questions. That is all.

Here comes my tongue-lashing!

[mjkuhns]

Where even to begin.

1. As others have noted, the most important point here is that even for those who judge Lakewood's present emergency care resources satisfactory, a statement that Issue 64 guarantees them is factually incorrect. Chief Gilman's unexplained "if it is supported" comment, and the precedent of Sagamore Hills ER, are ultimately just interesting context. Page four of the Master Agreement indisputably contradicts any assertion that it secures emergency care in Lakewood.

http://savelakewoodhospital.org/wp-cont ... ent-ER.jpg

2. How many firefighters have first hand knowledge of this highly relevant element of the Master Agreement which their union has endorsed?

3. Why did the union issue an endorsement of that agreement without communicating with the agreement's critics—some of whom also have considerable authority on lifesaving medical care?

4. Did the union consider contacting, say, Northfield Center-Sagamore Hills Fire Chief Frank Risko, who has first hand experience in the provision of emergency care after a local ER is converted to an express care site, as the Master Agreement will allow and as the Cleveland Clinic regards as a positive development for the local community?

5. Every time Chief Gilman refers to the video project of JP Finley he refers to an "edited video." Is he inferring that someone was misrepresented? (And if so, why was it necessary to dismiss those firefighters on the basis of "lack of experience?") Is the chief arguing that in order to "get our facts straightened out" we need all related statements to be made public in complete, unredacted form? Will he support the call of Jim O'Bryan and others to release all documents related to decisions on Lakewood Hospital?

http://www.onelakewood.com/lakewood-fir ... -hospital/

6. What is the chief's credibility, given his statement that "The narrative that’s been floated in the community that 'people will die' in transit to nearby healthcare facilities is dangerous rhetoric, completely false." So far as I know, Councilwoman Cindy Marx was entirely correct when she said on the same topic that "patients die in hospitals, they die in emergency rooms, they die in transport…” Why did Lakewood's fire chief make a formal statement to the Lakewood public reassuring us of something which, like Issue 64's claimed protection of local emergency care, is fundamentally incorrect?

[Bridget Conant]

The rank and file - did they vote to endorse or was it a union leadership decision, like it usually is?

Chief Gilman, I'd appreciate an answer.

It makes a difference.

[Lori Allen _]

I think everyone missed one important point here. If you allowed the Certification Verification certificate to completely download, you will see that Chief Gilman does not appear to be a certified paramedic in the state of Ohio at this time.

Why does he appear then, to be the medical spokesperson for City Hall and the Fire Department? Nine years without a paramedic license is a big gap!

This is not meant to be a personal attack on Mr. Gilman, however, it does make one question his medical and EMS credibility concerning the medical and EMS information he has been been telling all over town.