Another standoff?
Moderator: Jim O'Bryan
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John Guscott
- Posts: 51
- Joined: Fri Apr 08, 2005 11:25 am
- Location: Lakewood OH
Another standoff?
Oh, no.... not again?
Standoff on Coutant?
http://www.newsnet5.com/news/10833339/detail.html
http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_article.a ... ryid=62122
any more news on this?
Standoff on Coutant?
http://www.newsnet5.com/news/10833339/detail.html
http://www.wkyc.com/news/news_article.a ... ryid=62122
any more news on this?
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Mark Reinhold
- Posts: 20
- Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2006 11:23 am
I am writing you to express my concern with the ongoing police activity in the City. With 3 highly publicized SWAT actions in the city in the last year I am worried on many levels. I am worried about the effect that this activity has on our property values. I am worried about the public perception of Lakewood being Cleveland newest ward. I am worried that we have one of THE highest paid police forces on the West side and worried about their ability to prevent crime. I am worried about my children and especially about their safety.
About their safety.... Lakewood Catholic Academy was locked down last week due to auto theft activity in the area. How is that good?
Please look at the following chart and notice the trend in crime from 2002 - 2003 and compare that to crime statistics in 2004 - 2005. This shows that things are not advancing in the right direction.
Crime in Lakewood by Year
Type 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005
Murders 2 0 0 1 0 1 2
per 100,000 3.5 0.0 0.0 1.8 0.0 1.8 3.5
Rapes 5 8 7 5 4 7 5
per 100,000 8.8 14.1 12.4 8.8 7.1 12.4 8.8
Robberies 44 70 51 25 27 40 37
per 100,000 77.7 123.6 90.0 44.1 47.7 70.6 65.3
Assaults 32 79 57 33 54 77 70
per 100,000 56.5 139.5 100.6 58.3 95.3 135.9 123.6
Burglaries 202 211 243 230 192 291 237
per 100,000 356.6 372.5 429.0 406.0 338.9 513.7 418.4
Thefts 1,103 1,083 1,019 771 667 779 961
per 100,000 1947.2 1911.9 1798.9 1361.1 1177.5 1375.2 1696.5
Auto thefts 116 119 108 63 85 104 136
per 100,000 204.8 210.1 190.7 111.2 150.1 183.6 240.1
Arson 20 10 5 3 3 4 9
per 100,000 35.3 17.7 8.8 5.3 5.3 7.1 15.9
City-data.com crime index (higher means more crime, U.S. average = 325.2) 160.9 190.0 169.3 122.0 119.0 160.7 167.7
Please review the following statistics, please noting that I did the math quickly.
Murder up 100% from 2002 to 2005
Rape change 00% from 2002 to 2005
Robberies up 33% from 2002 to 2005
Assaults up 40% from 2002 to 2005
Burglaries up 50% from 2002 to 2005
Thefts up 33% from 2002 to 2005
Auto Theft up 60% from 2002 to 2005
Arson up 300% from 2002 to 2005
PLEASE NOTE THAT I UNDERSTAND THAT THE TRENDS FROM 1999 TO 2005 ARE QUITE DIFFERENT BUT SOMETHING WAS GOING RIGHT BEFORE MAYOR GEORGE'S TERM....as a city we have to discover what were those things. I cannot tell if the small correction from 2004 to 2005 will ever catch the pre-GEORGE levels.
About their safety.... Lakewood Catholic Academy was locked down last week due to auto theft activity in the area. How is that good?
Please look at the following chart and notice the trend in crime from 2002 - 2003 and compare that to crime statistics in 2004 - 2005. This shows that things are not advancing in the right direction.
Crime in Lakewood by Year
Type 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005
Murders 2 0 0 1 0 1 2
per 100,000 3.5 0.0 0.0 1.8 0.0 1.8 3.5
Rapes 5 8 7 5 4 7 5
per 100,000 8.8 14.1 12.4 8.8 7.1 12.4 8.8
Robberies 44 70 51 25 27 40 37
per 100,000 77.7 123.6 90.0 44.1 47.7 70.6 65.3
Assaults 32 79 57 33 54 77 70
per 100,000 56.5 139.5 100.6 58.3 95.3 135.9 123.6
Burglaries 202 211 243 230 192 291 237
per 100,000 356.6 372.5 429.0 406.0 338.9 513.7 418.4
Thefts 1,103 1,083 1,019 771 667 779 961
per 100,000 1947.2 1911.9 1798.9 1361.1 1177.5 1375.2 1696.5
Auto thefts 116 119 108 63 85 104 136
per 100,000 204.8 210.1 190.7 111.2 150.1 183.6 240.1
Arson 20 10 5 3 3 4 9
per 100,000 35.3 17.7 8.8 5.3 5.3 7.1 15.9
City-data.com crime index (higher means more crime, U.S. average = 325.2) 160.9 190.0 169.3 122.0 119.0 160.7 167.7
Please review the following statistics, please noting that I did the math quickly.
Murder up 100% from 2002 to 2005
Rape change 00% from 2002 to 2005
Robberies up 33% from 2002 to 2005
Assaults up 40% from 2002 to 2005
Burglaries up 50% from 2002 to 2005
Thefts up 33% from 2002 to 2005
Auto Theft up 60% from 2002 to 2005
Arson up 300% from 2002 to 2005
PLEASE NOTE THAT I UNDERSTAND THAT THE TRENDS FROM 1999 TO 2005 ARE QUITE DIFFERENT BUT SOMETHING WAS GOING RIGHT BEFORE MAYOR GEORGE'S TERM....as a city we have to discover what were those things. I cannot tell if the small correction from 2004 to 2005 will ever catch the pre-GEORGE levels.
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DougHuntingdon
- Posts: 527
- Joined: Tue Feb 07, 2006 10:29 pm
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ryan costa
- Posts: 2486
- Joined: Fri Jan 06, 2006 10:31 pm
source
It is the new popular past time.
This one is near the Cleveland border, so you can blame them Cleveland people. He may even be from The East Side. The previous guy was from Avon Lake. A lot of crazy stuff goes on in Avon Lake.
This one is near the Cleveland border, so you can blame them Cleveland people. He may even be from The East Side. The previous guy was from Avon Lake. A lot of crazy stuff goes on in Avon Lake.
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dl meckes
- Posts: 1475
- Joined: Mon Mar 07, 2005 6:29 pm
- Location: Lakewood
- Jim O'Bryan
- Posts: 14196
- Joined: Thu Mar 10, 2005 10:12 pm
- Location: Lakewood
- Contact:
dl meckes wrote:The incident on Coutant is over.
The subject overdosed and is being rushed to the hospital. We had Observers on the scene.
More and photos shortly.

A few minutes after the call...

... a couple minutes later

More Westshore SWAT Members arrive.

It's always tough for me to see this photo.

Lakewood Police and SWAT in the driveway of the house where the man was held up.
more on the blog soon.
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Jim O'Bryan
Lakewood Resident
"The very act of observing disturbs the system."
Werner Heisenberg
"If anything I've said seems useful to you, I'm glad.
If not, don't worry. Just forget about it."
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
Lakewood Resident
"The very act of observing disturbs the system."
Werner Heisenberg
"If anything I've said seems useful to you, I'm glad.
If not, don't worry. Just forget about it."
His Holiness The Dalai Lama
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Gary Rice
- Posts: 1651
- Joined: Wed Aug 23, 2006 9:59 pm
- Location: Lakewood
Coutant
See my just-posted photoblog for early response photos
http://lakewoodobserver.com/photoblogs/ ... n-coutant/
http://lakewoodobserver.com/photoblogs/ ... n-coutant/
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Brian Pedaci
- Posts: 496
- Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:17 am
Mark, wasn't Mayor Cain in charge for something like 7 or 8 years before Mayor George? Why do you think it took until nearly the end of her reign for numbers to dive? I'd look for some other factor beside just the mayor - what else could have contributed to the fantastic improvements of 2002? A new police chief or something like that? I'll be very interested to see the stats for 2006 when they are released to see how they compare and if the trends you point out continue. The numbers may look bad by themselves, but when compared to state or national averages, they're still quite good.
The events of the past week have me contemplating relocating to a more safe, serene suburb like, oh say... Strongsville.
Oh wait, there are crazy people with guns there too! Oh no!
The events of the past week have me contemplating relocating to a more safe, serene suburb like, oh say... Strongsville.
Oh wait, there are crazy people with guns there too! Oh no!
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Mark Reinhold
- Posts: 20
- Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2006 11:23 am
Brian,
Here's something I pulled off of the Lakewood website.
GENERAL POWERS AND DUTIES OF THE MAYOR
The Mayor of Lakewood is the chief elected official of the City and serves as its principal representative and spokesperson. The powers of the Mayor are established by charter, specifically by Article II of the Second Amended Charter (Sec. 1-10), approved by Lakewood voters on November 7, 2000. The position of Mayor is full-time (Art.II, Sec. 9), and the salary of the Mayor is established by ordinance adopted not less than thirty days prior to the final date for the filing of nominating petitions by candidates for the office of Mayor (Art.II, Sec. 5).
In addition to serving as the chief executive officer, the Mayor also serves as the Public Safety Director, the chief conservator of the peace within the City. Article II, Section 6, which enumerates the "General Powers and Duties of Mayor," establishes that the Mayor supervises the administration of the affairs of the City and sees that all ordinances of the City are enforced. The Mayor may recommend that City Council adopt "such measures as the Mayor may deem necessary or expedient," and the Mayor is entitled to introduce ordinances and resolutions and take part in the discussion of all matters that come before City Council (Art.II, Sec. 10). Performance of the Mayor's powers and duties are conferred or required by the Second Amended Charter, by ordinance or resolution of Council, or by general law.
Tom George is Public Safety Director and the Chief conservator of the peace and my kids had a lock down at their school last week, the second lock down in the last year... and we have had 3 major SWAT operations within the last year, 4 if you count today.
I felt horrible today when listening to the radio at work today..."IT'S HAPPENING AGAIN TODAY IN LAKEWOOD!"... WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE EAST SIDE OF LAKEWOOD?"...."SECOND STAND-OFF IN THE CITY OF LAKEWOOD IN FOUR DAYS"
I agree that 2002 and 2003 were the lowest years for crime in recent history, I know Tom George took office in 2004, I know crime has risen since then .... I do not know what is in the future. I hope for the best, but I will surely vote with this issue being paramount in my mind.
Here's something I pulled off of the Lakewood website.
GENERAL POWERS AND DUTIES OF THE MAYOR
The Mayor of Lakewood is the chief elected official of the City and serves as its principal representative and spokesperson. The powers of the Mayor are established by charter, specifically by Article II of the Second Amended Charter (Sec. 1-10), approved by Lakewood voters on November 7, 2000. The position of Mayor is full-time (Art.II, Sec. 9), and the salary of the Mayor is established by ordinance adopted not less than thirty days prior to the final date for the filing of nominating petitions by candidates for the office of Mayor (Art.II, Sec. 5).
In addition to serving as the chief executive officer, the Mayor also serves as the Public Safety Director, the chief conservator of the peace within the City. Article II, Section 6, which enumerates the "General Powers and Duties of Mayor," establishes that the Mayor supervises the administration of the affairs of the City and sees that all ordinances of the City are enforced. The Mayor may recommend that City Council adopt "such measures as the Mayor may deem necessary or expedient," and the Mayor is entitled to introduce ordinances and resolutions and take part in the discussion of all matters that come before City Council (Art.II, Sec. 10). Performance of the Mayor's powers and duties are conferred or required by the Second Amended Charter, by ordinance or resolution of Council, or by general law.
Tom George is Public Safety Director and the Chief conservator of the peace and my kids had a lock down at their school last week, the second lock down in the last year... and we have had 3 major SWAT operations within the last year, 4 if you count today.
I felt horrible today when listening to the radio at work today..."IT'S HAPPENING AGAIN TODAY IN LAKEWOOD!"... WHAT'S WRONG WITH THE EAST SIDE OF LAKEWOOD?"...."SECOND STAND-OFF IN THE CITY OF LAKEWOOD IN FOUR DAYS"
I agree that 2002 and 2003 were the lowest years for crime in recent history, I know Tom George took office in 2004, I know crime has risen since then .... I do not know what is in the future. I hope for the best, but I will surely vote with this issue being paramount in my mind.
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Jeff Endress
- Posts: 858
- Joined: Mon Apr 04, 2005 11:13 am
- Location: Lakewood
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Brian Pedaci
- Posts: 496
- Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:17 am
Mark, it's cool to point at the Mayor in a 'buck stops here' mindset and ask what's being done to preserve the general peace. But I ask you, seriously, what could a police force or a Mayor do to proactively prevent occurrences like Saturday or today? Nothing comes to mind. These are freak situations, and not a true reflection of the community in which they occur. What would you do if in Mayor George's position?
You have a point about other sorts of crime, even if it is completely unrelated to the event we're discussing in this thread. Do you have any statistics on the number of crimes committed vs. the number prosecuted? That would be a more telling gauge of the efficiency of the police and law departments. If the number of crimes have gone up, but a higher percentage of the perps end up behind bars than before then I'd say we're still making progress, wouldn't you? Anyone know where stats like that would be available?
You have a point about other sorts of crime, even if it is completely unrelated to the event we're discussing in this thread. Do you have any statistics on the number of crimes committed vs. the number prosecuted? That would be a more telling gauge of the efficiency of the police and law departments. If the number of crimes have gone up, but a higher percentage of the perps end up behind bars than before then I'd say we're still making progress, wouldn't you? Anyone know where stats like that would be available?
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stephen davis
- Posts: 600
- Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2005 9:49 pm
- Location: lakewood, ohio
Mark,Mark Reinhold wrote:
Crime in Lakewood by Year
Type 1999 2000 2001 2002 2003 2004 2005
Burglaries 202 211 243 230 192 291 237
per 100,000 356.6 372.5 429.0 406.0 338.9 513.7 418.4
Murder up 100% from 2002 to 2005
Rape change 00% from 2002 to 2005
Robberies up 33% from 2002 to 2005
Assaults up 40% from 2002 to 2005
Burglaries up 50% from 2002 to 2005
Thefts up 33% from 2002 to 2005
Auto Theft up 60% from 2002 to 2005
Arson up 300% from 2002 to 2005
PLEASE NOTE THAT I UNDERSTAND THAT THE TRENDS FROM 1999 TO 2005 ARE QUITE DIFFERENT BUT SOMETHING WAS GOING RIGHT BEFORE MAYOR GEORGE'S TERM....as a city we have to discover what were those things. I cannot tell if the small correction from 2004 to 2005 will ever catch the pre-GEORGE levels.
Using your numbers, burglaries rose by just over 3 percent from 2002 to 2005. I will just assume that your other numbers are correct. I'm not here to just correct your math. I understand your point, but I offer another angle.
Some of your statistics may show a trend, but others may not. It seems that Lakewood murders are generally between zero and two per year, and with no obvious pattern. To say " Murder up 100%" when comparing a one-murder year and a two-murder year, even with a zero and a one in between, may be mathematically correct, but it does not show a trend. (I was just trying to figure the percentage increase from a zero to a two. Can't divide by zero, soooo....oh well, forget it.)
Anyway, there may be measurable trends in your data that are worth looking at. Unfortunately, for those trends to be meaningful, we would have to assume that data has been kept and reported accurately by different law enforcement officers and mayors' administrations. I am not convinced of the veracity of the data reported, especially in the previous administration. I only hope this administration's data is accurate.
Your post was interesting. I'm just not sure where to point a finger, or if finger pointing is in order.
Steve
Nothin' shakin' on Shakedown Street.
Used to be the heart of town.
Don't tell me this town ain't got no heart.
You just gotta poke around.
Robert Hunter/Sometimes attributed to Ezra Pound.
Used to be the heart of town.
Don't tell me this town ain't got no heart.
You just gotta poke around.
Robert Hunter/Sometimes attributed to Ezra Pound.
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Mark Reinhold
- Posts: 20
- Joined: Thu Feb 23, 2006 11:23 am
Given a choice ... I choose a year with zero murders.
Go on http://www.city-data.com/city/Ohio.html and you will see a number of cities with zero murders.
I absolutely could be over reacting to the news cycle.... but who in Lakewood could be happy with being in the media with two horrible stories in four days?
Sorry about the math... was only looking at 2003 in that case. ... I don't want to be the city that's best at SWAT responces
Go on http://www.city-data.com/city/Ohio.html and you will see a number of cities with zero murders.
I absolutely could be over reacting to the news cycle.... but who in Lakewood could be happy with being in the media with two horrible stories in four days?
Sorry about the math... was only looking at 2003 in that case. ... I don't want to be the city that's best at SWAT responces
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Brian Pedaci
- Posts: 496
- Joined: Wed Nov 08, 2006 1:17 am
How many of those cities are comparable to Lakewood's size?
Let's see...
Euclid (pop 52717) - 3
Kettering (pop 57502) - 5
Hamilton (pop 60690) - 3 (down from a high of 7)
I could go on... my point? Like Stephen said, one or two here or there is a statistical anomaly. We're doing pretty good overall.
Look, talk radio creeps will push anything they can that will generate talk. They're slagging Lakewood today but tomorrow it'll be something else. Why let it get to you?
If you want to see something that will make you feel better, go look here:
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/moneymag ... 41664.html
Personal crime risk
(100 is nat'l average; lower is better) 25
Property crime risk
(100 is nat'l average; lower is better) 57
I'll take those numbers anyday. Nobody's happy about this weird week in the 'Wood. I had to take my family to Parma for a day. I'm probably more pissed than most
Maybe it's just that Lakewood looks great in comparison to Ohio City (where we just moved from), but sometimes all the negativity I see here and on the 'other Lakewood board' make ME want to snap and have the SWAT team called in on me.
Let's see...
Euclid (pop 52717) - 3
Kettering (pop 57502) - 5
Hamilton (pop 60690) - 3 (down from a high of 7)
I could go on... my point? Like Stephen said, one or two here or there is a statistical anomaly. We're doing pretty good overall.
Look, talk radio creeps will push anything they can that will generate talk. They're slagging Lakewood today but tomorrow it'll be something else. Why let it get to you?
If you want to see something that will make you feel better, go look here:
http://money.cnn.com/magazines/moneymag ... 41664.html
Personal crime risk
(100 is nat'l average; lower is better) 25
Property crime risk
(100 is nat'l average; lower is better) 57
I'll take those numbers anyday. Nobody's happy about this weird week in the 'Wood. I had to take my family to Parma for a day. I'm probably more pissed than most
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Kenneth Warren
- Posts: 489
- Joined: Sat Mar 26, 2005 7:17 pm
While I can understand the worry of a parent when the world becomes crazed with madmen and criminals, and his children are hanging in the balance, I can see no defects in the performance of the Mayor or the police in these disturbing incidents, which raise more questions about community mental health and the aftermath of de-industrialization of American labor and de-institutionalization of the mentally ill.
For decades hostile, dangerous and unpredictable psychotics have been released into communities across America without proper funding to ensure treatment and supervision.
What we are seeing in the hell of Lakewood’s excess supply of housing is the snowballing of economic, psychological and social effects that hinge on global, national, regional and state policy issues that have cost jobs, made people go ballistic and gutted the social safety net.
And it can be expected that in a nation committed to “Total War†there will be more veterans in need of psychological help and medications, too.
As we witness the shaky efforts to absorb the mentally ill, economically broken, and socially dysfunctional into our community, we must take heed and organize a vision, strategy and political muscle strong enough to advance Lakewood’s interests across multiple fronts – from the block watch to the board rooms of agencies that deliver mental health, from the standards to which landlords and half-way houses conduct their business.
Again this is far more than a police matter, as much as one would like to lay issues of disorder on their watch.
We cannot hang back, hoping the implementation of CITISTAT and the problem solving skill sets that will follow from its implementation will guarantee the anti-psychotic medications are properly administered with a seven day regime.
While I respect the Mayor as a man of action, I hope, too that he will connect the dots for us with Hagan, Dimora, Jones, Fisher and Strickland and tell us how he will lead a vigorous political intervention and policy instigation on the dark corners and special interests that profit from the destruction of our community.
In short, we need to demand a state-wide regional multi-county reconstruction of total care for the mentally ill. This is not a job for the police. This is a job for psychiatric facilities.
Kenneth Warren
For decades hostile, dangerous and unpredictable psychotics have been released into communities across America without proper funding to ensure treatment and supervision.
What we are seeing in the hell of Lakewood’s excess supply of housing is the snowballing of economic, psychological and social effects that hinge on global, national, regional and state policy issues that have cost jobs, made people go ballistic and gutted the social safety net.
And it can be expected that in a nation committed to “Total War†there will be more veterans in need of psychological help and medications, too.
As we witness the shaky efforts to absorb the mentally ill, economically broken, and socially dysfunctional into our community, we must take heed and organize a vision, strategy and political muscle strong enough to advance Lakewood’s interests across multiple fronts – from the block watch to the board rooms of agencies that deliver mental health, from the standards to which landlords and half-way houses conduct their business.
Again this is far more than a police matter, as much as one would like to lay issues of disorder on their watch.
We cannot hang back, hoping the implementation of CITISTAT and the problem solving skill sets that will follow from its implementation will guarantee the anti-psychotic medications are properly administered with a seven day regime.
While I respect the Mayor as a man of action, I hope, too that he will connect the dots for us with Hagan, Dimora, Jones, Fisher and Strickland and tell us how he will lead a vigorous political intervention and policy instigation on the dark corners and special interests that profit from the destruction of our community.
In short, we need to demand a state-wide regional multi-county reconstruction of total care for the mentally ill. This is not a job for the police. This is a job for psychiatric facilities.
Kenneth Warren